/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

People who support "herd immunity" are basically just supporting "eugenics" Omnicron is deadly and we are nearing 1mill deaths in the US but you stupid ass hillbillies can't understand that. The vaccine prevents you from dying. Every single case of a death was from an unvaccinated person.

Why is that?

>>454386
From what I've read Omicron presents itself as a cold. Your death count is inflated because anyone that tests positive with a pcr test for covid after death is counted. There are huge problems measuring deaths like that.

Why do you think omicron is deadly?

>>454386
Couple more things: Your first point about herd immunity being eugenics is nonsense. Herd immunity is a real thing that health historically aims for with vaccines.

Using experimental drugs on people who would not go to the hospital for covid (ones that are young and healthy) is eugenics. You seem to be twisting the facts on purpose.

>>454386
the flu also kills people, should we lockdown evreytime a few people catch that

>>454388
Well not shit herd immunity is a real thing. It's eugenics. Natural selection is the real actuals Tate of nature. We as human beings are above that. Or, at least we strive to be.

Also the death count isn't infalted. You retards just can't understand comorbidities.

I will never understand why there are leftists who would be on the same side as Bill Gates on something that is clearly very important to Bill Gates' global health governance idea, that has been utterly disastrous to the credibility of any left movement. The whole thing is so ridiculously over the top that anyone vaguely in favor of workers should be vociferously opposed to everything that is happening. They literally make a mask mandate for workers, enforced by corporate policy and lawfare, that is designed purely to demonstrate to the bosses that workers will be kept in place. None of this is anything you'd do if you cared about saving lives or responding to a disease with any sort of effectiveness. From the start, the governments have used this as their pretext to defund anything that goes to saving the lives of workers, and so hospitals are shuttered immediately as "the pandemic" hits, and people act surprised when death rates go up. The only explanation I can think of is that a lot of leftists figured out a few years ago that when fascism came, they were going to roll into the fascist regime. It was pretty clear in 2019 we were going to get fascism and there was nothing that could realistically stop it.

Anyway trying to debate the facts of the virus is missing the point. If there is a novel coronavirus, the governments of the world certainly aren't doing anything that would help against that. All I've seen suggests that the disease, so far as it exists, is basically a nastier version of the common cold. It wouldn't even warrant a response like this unless it were the planned scenario for waging class war (and you can look up the history going into Event 201 and similar pandemic scenario games - this was going to be their preferred scenario since 2010 at the latest). Those who still remember actual science could have told you that the public health ghouls - all sponsored by the fucking Davos assholes - are suggesting nonsense. The only way this use of quarantine and tracking would work is if your tracking system has far more information than any government or entity could amass on their own people - that is, they would have to believe that they actually live in the antiseptic, completely controlled world that they're trying to create already. Otherwise, your information on the ground is not reliable enough to do much at all. Even if you lived in such a world, you wouldn't keep lockdowns, closures, mandates, and so on active for over two years, when they haven't worked and show no sign of doing anything. But, none of this has been about a virus. It has purely been about punishing enemies, for all who have been enabled to share their stupid opinions about the situation. All who are advancing stupid horseshit opinions probably made the calculation that it's better to take the mandates and restrictions as a given, because it's more favorable for whatever shitty agenda they have in mind. No one wants the actually decent thing, except - surprise surprise - the majority of people, who are the real losers of this sorry situation.

Anyway, I don't think you can reduce the "anti-covid" message to some simple slogan that is suitable for performative politics. That's what has made this offensive so damning. To even begin knowing what is going on requires rethinking first of all the narratives about the society we live in, and narratives about the motives of political actors elite and small. There have only been some of the Marxists who have consistently got this issue right, and they're far from perfect. The circles of anti-lockdown socialists I've seen have become very desperate, feeling correctly that this is the end. The rightoids have colonized all major dissent, just as the plan was likely drawn to do, and they steer the base back towards rabid anticommunism and other faggotry.

>>454388
Funny thing about that is that herd immunity's definition was ninja-editted once the old definition was no longer suitable for what Bill Gates, Wellcome Trust, and the other eugenicist assholes wanted from the pandemic narrative. You could have done literally nothing and the result would have been more lives saved than what happened. But the powers that be wanted death and crisis, and there's a sick element in the left that also wants death and crisis, and of course the rightoids have always loved death and crisis as a pretext for their usual shit.

>>454411
In the grand scope of things you are on the same side as all of the capitalist. This is Capitalism and this is why you have a shitty and retarded analysis; Everything under capital is subject to the whims of profits. Everything. Basically what you are saying is that "there's ethical alternatives! just boycott the industry." It's liberalism and you are a liberal. There is a pandemic (or at least was) that, to an over all extent, has been fucking with the general flow of capital.


What you are saying is literally just "get back to work" because a few companies might make money. You are a grifter and a fucking faggot and should ki yourself. You literally support capitalism you just think there's alternative markets; and you dress up like a leftist.

>>454388
>immunity is a real thing
AHAHAH

THE SCIENCE HAS CRASHED, WE NEED TO BAIL OUT THE SCIENCE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xaCSAASZr4A

>>454416
The selected winners have made ridiculous profits and bought out their competitors. Bill Gates wouldn't be going on TV to tell the world his grand plans if he thought all of this was terrible for his bottom line. Nor would these lockdowns be supported by the ruling liberal parties if they were at all concerned about the economic consequences. Why would they be concerned? The businesses that lose were those considered outmoded for the regime of the future, and those businesses were paid off by Trump with tax money / government debt basically.

Since workers are back to work - if they're lucky enough to still have a job - I fail to see how this is some sort of win for the working class. The working class has been annihilated over the past two years, literally. One effect of the lockdowns is that it imposed Social Darwinian conditions on the workers, just as it did with the failed businesses. Workers who didn't have a place in the new normal were never going to find a job, except they didn't have Trump or conservative parties giving them goodies. They just got a kick in the teeth, in a long series of kicks to the teeth.

It's so over the top that I don't know how opposition to this insanity isn't automatic for anyone considering themselves pro-worker, pro-masses, or in favor of not having a fascist dictatorship. But most people have already accepted fascism in their hearts. It was only a matter of time before it became official.

Maybe in your world this ruination is some kind of socialism, but again, Amazon made ridiculous profits and the WEF Davos assholes wouldn't be promoting the new normal if they thought it was bad for business or bad for oligarchic rule.

>>454421
>I don't know how opposition to this insanity isn't automatic
Humanity is degenerate. Just a matter of fact. I don't know how we will ever come back from this situation.

>>454424
That has been my conclusion too - humanity failed and the only possible good in the world will be at a small scale, always on the run from a predatory world. The old concept that we could have decency in the world can't survive in the world to come, where it will be a crime to defend yourself. You're left with a very grim fate where people are stuck living in their own world, lucky if they can form anything at all involving more than a few people. Once you get big enough, the predators will come to destroy whatever decency you create for yourself and those around you. I don't see it changing - it could change, but the ugly reality is that too many people want to make sure it never changes, because it would mean the end of a predatory arrangement if it were accepted people are morally right to defend themselves against such predation.

It's just so laughable because even ten years ago, the idea that this would be carried as far as it has was way out there. There were always those amenable to this form of fascism, but too many saw such a regime as what it is and would have refused to go along. I should have figured that as my generation became older, it was inevitable we would get something like this, but I didn't think it would meet with this little resistance, where people can't even bring themselves to say basic truth about what is happening. People certainly know it's wrong, but there is no language to articulate what exactly went wrong. To even begin would make someone invalid in a predatory world like this. It's not a problem for me, but me being me makes anything I say or do automatically wrong and something to mock. It's always been the case though, those who cannot accept the wrong in this world are ruthlessly attacked. I'm not the only person this has happened to.

>>454421
>>454421
And once again you have failed to address any pints I have made. Again you are supporting the over a general flow of capital and cherry picking one company as a justification for your self defeating logic.

Take your meds skitzo.

>>454411
>I will never understand why there are leftists who would be on the same side as Bill Gates
Leftists are not on the same side as bill Gates, leftists want open source vaccines Bill gates wants proprietary vaccines.
Leftists want to take profits that capitalists made from the virus and use it to pay workers if they have lost any income because of the virus, Bill gates does not want to have his bio-tech portfolio profits taxed away.

>>454434
The argument is a non sequiter tho anyways because just because a capitalist made it doesn't fucking inherently make it bad and just cause the currently government says it doesn't make it neccesarily untrue even if that is the case most of the time. Getting the vaccine is important and yes so is fucking locking down ffs. That was true of this pandemic and it will be true of the next one. Anyone who says other wise is promoting the interests of capital. Period.

>>454435
No you're missing the point that's not what the argument is, the anon is saying the government response to the virus benefits capitalist interests and explaining how. During this pandemic we've seen the biggest growth in wealth inequality since 2008 probably. Resistance to medical apartheid is actually disturbing the flow of capital and scaring porky, millions of dollars were lost from the ambassador bridge blockade alone. If this isn't good enough for you I want to see you armchairs doing something better.

>>454436
This just sounds like nonsense though. The virus itself is interrupting the flow of capital and yes that is a good thing but the working class shouldn't come at it's expense. What you guys are saying is that working people are worth sacrificing to interrupt the flow of capital. It's gross my guy.

>>454437
It's the usual Zizekian faggotry.

>>454436
This is correct, although for many reasons the "Freedom convoys" are controlled resistance. What is definitely the case is that the capitalists are very gung-ho on imposing vaccine mandates and every other mandate on workers, because they see the new regime as a way to crush all resistance to lower wages and expropriation. That's what is so funny about the "national bourgeoisie" faggots, if they actually believed their drivel you'd see Home Depot ignoring the mask mandate like most of the country does wherever it's still up. You can even see corps going above the actual mandates - not even ordinances, since this forced masking nonsense has all been emergency ordered and dumb, like everything else that is done in the name of this biofascist horseshit. Part of this is an experiment in outright corporate governance displacing what was considered the public sector or the roles of the traditional government. I don't know how you can't see this if you're at all familar with the history of fascism and neoliberalism.

The funny thing is that the state's prerogatives to control public health has been a traditionally right-wing thing, predating the fascists but for the Nazis such prerogatives were central to Nazism. The entire basis for Nazism was premised on the health of the volk being a pretext to purge undesirables from society. (The other side of course is that the Nazis claimed that this was a defense of the freedom of the strong against the tyranny of the weak, and so like many things in America, both sides of the controlled narrative are fascist in some way.)

I would make my argument against mandates and forced vaccination not a matter of freedom vs. biomedical prerogatives, but that the mandates and vaccines are so obviously not effective and certainly not worth the costs they have imposed. If you're a rich oligarch though, the vaccine mandate means that public spending (that is, your tax dollars and public debt that you are expected to repay in the future) goes towards your profit margins, selling to a captive audience. So even from that angle, I have to wonder why leftists are on the side of Pfizer reaping profits, if this is about crushing capitalism or something. It makes no sense at all.
So even if you claim that the state should have extraordinary powers for a medical emergency - and this is ruling class precedent so it's not like 2020 brought something new or unexpected - the use of those extraordinary powers has always been understood to require some public support, so that people actually follow the directives. It usually means that sweeping biofascist pushes designed to punish the masses, for the benefit of the fascist party, are a really bad idea, unless your objective was using a biopolitical rationale for your state and pushing it to the maximum possible. Again, this isn't a new precedent that suddenly began now, where before it was unheard of. There are quite a few examples of this prerogative that have been accepted, at least by a majority of people. It really starts with the need to use the medical system for political goals, and a particularly medical rationale for punishing political enemies and undesirables. It was more acceptable to use these extraordinary powers on a minority that have been historically reviled and that already was an ideological enemy of liberalism at the most basic, visceral level. It's something else when those extraordinary powers are turned on the majority of people, benefitting a few people who believe that this is going to bring about the Boogaloo or going to give them a lot of money.

>>454440
There is literally zero hope for humanity >>>/doom/

>>454441
As a whole, there isn't hope, but this current madness will be resisted, is being resisted around the world. Even if people have to resist alone, they will resist, out of necessity. This isn't just an American or European thing. People around the world are fighting against this global push, refusing to go along. The main difficulty is that the intellectual currents are all in favor of this global war against the people, and so the idea cannot be expressed clearly without being destroyed on sight. But it must exist, because the world the regime wants to create is an abomination.

As dire as the situation is, at some point you have to ignore the ideologues and their stupid narrative-centered view of history that has never worked. I think this year, the operation is going to move past COVID restrictions anyway, and move on to more financial coup / 4IR Great Reset faggotry. COVID has been exhausted of its usefulness, and cannot press further without meeting resistance. Too many people will do everything possible to not comply with the vaccine mandate, and crucially there are enough doctors who will write fake papers. You're still going to get digital ID and social credit, but that was the really important thing for the rulers. They don't care so much if you get your vaccine, though they would have liked people to sheepishly line up for injections with god-knows-what in them. They'll try again with forced vaccinations in the near future, but Billy Gates has already telegraphed that they're going to find a new disease as their pretext. They can only stretch out fear of the common cold so much, and they're losing the normies who have seen enough of this nonsense and wonder what the fuss is about. I suppose they have that weaponized smallpox laying around that they've been itching to use…

>>454444
Nice gets but you're literally psychotic

>>454447
This is literally how the ruling class drew up their plans. It's not a super big secret, unless you're a mystifier who is brainwashed. It's so ridiculous really how the left is the last people to know anything. 20 years of shitty fake journalism really did their work on the leftoids. If you're Klaus Schwab and that whole group, why would you bother pretending that you're not going to change the world? As far as they care, they are entirely in the right to take what they consider theirs, and crush the people who have never appreciated elite rule. You'd have to believe that the elite of the world do what they do because they are benevolent and somehow serve the people, which is never how it went in history. The only people who believe this are, again, new leftoids raised on a diet of pure ideology. There's a decent chunk of the middle class who are on board with that WEF program, because they see themselves as beneficiaries of the new normal, against the broad masses they have come to loathe. I don't know how much "I'm the real genius and these STUPID normals are keeping me down" you have to hear to figure out just how fucked humanity is. We live in a Nazified world, and people like you enabled it if you aren't a believer in this Nazification yourself (which I'm guessing you are). But that's where we are at.

You can be pointed to Klaus Schwab's own fucking book - and he published it because he WANTED it to be read - and look at how much that has been pushed ahead. You'd still deny it, because you're a mystifier who wants nothing but performative politics. You'll keep doing it until the very end, take your bribes, then do more shitty influencer gigs, living whatever miserable life you have to go back to. You're disgusting.
Anyway the point is that we're not at "this is a shady conspiracy coming". This is the conspiratorial plan coming out, and the conspirators have since 2020 done everything to rally the faithful to that banner. It turns out there are a lot more people amenable to this Great Reset program than they probably thought they'd get, and much less resistance. Something of this scale should have been riots, if not an outright civil war, given the enormity of what happened in 2020. You have to admire just how brazen they are and how they get away with it. But, the internet was always lost to influencers, and the faithful will follow fascism to the bitter end. There is no strategy that works against fascists except to root them out and either kill them or force them to live in perpetual terror.

>>454450
I've said it before and I'll say it again you are missing the forest gazing at trees and you refuse to listen. Probably because you are a fed.

>>454451
I think it's you who misses the fucking obvious, and you who is a fed. You'd have to be a fed to be this insistent on believing WEF doesn't exist when they fucking publish articles for the general public. Literal gaslighting.

>>454452
>>454451
Like I said, it's Zizek shit. Substitute this blatantly batshit idea of what capitalism is for what capitalism actually is, and then push it aggressively so that people can't say a single true thing about what those who rule do.

Fucking Hitlerites, that's what you all are…

>>454437
>What you guys are saying is that working people are worth sacrificing to interrupt the flow of capital.
Nobody itt is saying this

>The virus itself is interrupting the flow of capital
Riiiiight the "virus" and not a bunch of trucks on the ambassador bridge.

The virus literally resulted in the largest flow of money to capitalists. They profited massively from the virus. The virus made the richer a lot more rich.

Are you thick?

>>454456
This so much.
I've never quite understood the mental leap necessary to believe the lockdowns and mandates even work, after two years of this. So if the idea is that giving Bill Gates and the usual ghouls more power will save us, we've been doing that for two years and death tolls keep rising. I can tell you that aside from government austerity, none of the government policies were going to save millions or even thousands of lives from a respiratory infection. Most people here stopped caring about the virus narrative after June 2020 and tried to get back to their lives as much as they could. Unless the idea was that making people as miserable as possible was going to stop the virus, I don't see how giving Bill Gates everything he wanted saved anyone's life. That's what really gets my head scratching. I would think two years of failure would have made it clear what a scam it all is, and the only thing they can think of is to double down and give even more power to Bill Gates and the usual suspects.

It's funny because I don't think the NPI concept is inherently evil or unworkable because of The Science saying so, but if you think about the lockdown strategy for five minutes, even the most totalitarian state you can imagine with super advanced tech could not do much more than doing nothing at all. The contact tracing thing seems super strong, until you realize that the whole thing kind of relies on an honor system, and in any such lockdown strategy, you have to assume the vast majority of people are not going to lie to the government and want to trust their government. At the start of this, a surprising number of Americans did still trust their government, which is amazing after all the lies. All that trust was burned in a couple of weeks as the government kept lying and lying and screaming at us that we were all on our own. The institutions betrayed the people royally, and if there was anything that was done to reduce the deathtoll of a virus, it was all ordinary people looking out for themselves and each other and not the result of any government policy. You could have had medical infrastructure that wasn't a cash grab joke system and done far better than this shit show, but guess whose idea it was to make medical extortion a large part of the American economy, and guess who continued to enable it? And, if you think China is somehow better, I should probably remind the reader just how fucked China has been since the Deng reforms, and how much ordinary Chinese give absolutely no shits about civic virtue. Even the CCP can't fake it much more, but it doesn't matter because daddy Xi made some bitchin' propaganda videos.

>>454456
Well yeah no one is saying it but it's what you are "saying"

Retard the virus (yes the real actually existing fucking virus) cost porky billions through lock downs we had the biggest market crash in history. How fucking dense are you people?

>>454460
>And, if you think China is somehow better, I should probably remind the reader just how fucked China has been since the Deng reforms, and how much ordinary Chinese give absolutely no shits about civic virtue
I don't disagree with you, but how can you make such bold statements? Do you know a lot of people on mainland China that can confirm this or are you deducting logically here?

>>454460
>>454460
They work because you have to be with in a certain range of people to spread the virus you moron. If you minimize distance between people and contact between people you slow the spread of the virus. How is it possible to be this kind bogglingly stupid? I'm dead serious. It's such basic common sense words fail me that anyone could question this.

Wether people care or not people are dying and you selfish faggots deserve a fucking bat to the face. If you retards would shut the fuck up and chill the fuck out and do what is recommended this would have been over ages ago. Kill yourself you fucking psuedo intellectual faggot.

>>454461
They aren't even subtle about it

>>454480
Wow yes the market recovered fucking congrats you retards don't understand economics. Tons of porkies went under you morons. Small bussniess was slaughter in the last 4 years you're cherry picking cause you're to retarded for macro economics.

>>454437
> What you guys are saying is that working people are worth sacrificing to interrupt the flow of capital
Yes that's literally what revolution is

>>454470
You have a whole lot of evidence that lockdown / closure / masking policy has been arbitrary for the past two years, and none of it has a significant impact on hospital admissions, death rate, or anything we would use. The WEF line is that if death rates rise, we didn't lock down hard enough, and if they fall slightly, we didn't lock down hard enough and if we just do it harder we will reach some impossible goal of an antiseptic world where no one ever gets sick and the technocracy is perfect. It's a delusional belief at the very core, and it's always heads I win, tails you lose.

The truth, of course, is that all the reporting on this has been suspect from the start, and if you think American health care is any sort of perfect system, you're delusional. It is far more likely that the lockdown policies are really about preventing "social contagion" - that is, acclimating people to a permanent state of emergency where others are seen as disease vectors. The whole thing is eugenic thinking gone apeshit, and that's entirely the point - to get people to practice every day the biopolitical views necessary for the "new normal". If you wanted to stop people from getting sick, you would actually treat people instead of slashing medical budgets, and you would allow people to stay home if they are sick. You wouldn't be looking to raid old peoples' pension funds (but that happened long before covid, this is just the result of many years of looting). You wouldn't give corporations more power to fire arbitrarily and place onerous restrictions that forbid workers from taking time off, or collecting unemployment. It's rather curious that the only thing the lockdown left can imagine is an eternal NEET life of collecting sporadic stimulus checks, rather than defending what already exists in labor rights and entitlements. It's very telling where we are going with social security, because I suspect next year we're getting huge cuts (as in, disability will be taken away entirely, already presaged by the Trump era). I'm expecting a death toll in the millions not from the coof but from crushing Yeltsin-tier austerity, probably worse than that even. If the left were serious and in a doomer mood, they'd be preparing to fight, not enabling WEF / Davos assholes in their plunder by aligning with Bill fucking Gates.

>>454467
Logical deduction and, well, it's not too hard to figure out what mainland Chinese say, even with the censorship and no one being too vocal.

>>454487
>The virus is revolution

Touch grass.

Revolutionary struggle is born of the masses own fruition not because some retarded truckers are to stupid to take their shots and isolatiand wear a mask.

>>454496

The point of lock downs is to prevent the spread of the vrius you hack. No matter how many walls of text and times you change the subject that is the bottom line fact; We do this to keep our fucking medical infrastructure from imploding god you are a retared fag.

>>454508
The medical infrastructure is imploding - very deliberately. One of the first things of the "pandemic" was to slash budgets and introduce policies rushing sick people to death, moreso than anything that had been seen before. When doctors are rushing patients to secretive back rooms and not allowing people to see their family members, what do you think is happening? The so-called euthanasia policies are not a secret - end-of-life care protocols were released as soon as the pandemic started to get rid of the excess population. Now they're the new normal and the death rate accelerates as needed for the pandemic narrative. When they need more lockdowns, they claim more COVID deaths, when they need to say the lockdowns work or release the lockdown, they attribute the deaths to other causes, only to repeat the cycle as needed to maintain the cyclical destruction caused by these policies.

If you wanted to actually fight a disease, the lockdown strategy is nonsensical for a whole lot of reasons, and clearly it hasn't stopped hospital budgets from imploding and being managed to basically push death. The policies against the underclass have been around for a long time, instituted way back in the 1970s for explicitly neoliberal purposes. Now they are simply being extended to the general populace, while the elite and connected get special health care. I can tell you the horror stories of hospitals going out of their way to deny any care. It's been my entire life. The pandemic declaration was really a declaration that the majority of humanity are incurably insane, so they can be treated like I have been. It's been coming for a while, and people like you enable it, towards your own doom but you're too much of a cuckold to see the fucking obvious.

>>454508
I commend your patience. It seems the anti-vax, "let the virus rip" crypto-rightoid bots are committed to this walls of text spam tactic online

>>454523
You're assuming 'let the virus rip' is the null position, as if there only screaming eugenism or… screaming eugenism. Those are the only admissible position in a eugenist view of the world, that we have biopolitical control that is used to target undesirables, or that we let the virus do natural selection. The answer has been obvious since the start - actually treat the sick, which is also inadmissible in eugenism. The virus didn't force hospitals to enact policies designed to kill off excess population, or put people through a rigamarole for basic health care, where you can't even get a simple antibiotic or painkiller. It's taken as a default position that a bureaucracy designed purely to immiserate people is normal and unassailable. If we didn't have this, we don't accept the premise of miserablism and you actually save lives. None of the lockdowns have saved a life and obviously they don't stop any virus, and couldn't given how they have been imposed. The only distancing that would save anyone's life is that which people did themselves, autonomously. This only would require the government to issue advisories, not make a series of dictatorial rules with unceasing threats of fines and forced vaccines that cause injuries. Literally the only thing the government did that could be construed as actually helping is acknowledging that a virus is here and that people could take precautions. What they did with coronavirus is nothing like past public health interventions. Past outbreaks of smallpox usually involved local responses, and in those local responses the authorities understood they required the acceptance of the policy to even begin. Because the government didn't make over the top lies, and didn't accompany those interventions with rampant looting of the people, it was a lot easier for the authorities to get people following the intervention strategy, usually the government setting up free vaccinations which almost everyone accepted. Forced vaccination as a strategy has never worked, because if someone believes a vaccine will injure them in any serious way, you're never going to threaten them into compliance with any fine or jail sentence. People do not march into doing something that they believe makes them sick, and there has been enough of a history of vaccine injuries for people to have reasonable trepidation about taking a vaccine. With smallpox vaccines, inoculation and before then variolation was willfully undertaken because people did not want smallpox during an outbreak when times are real tough, regardless of the risks of the vaccine. It used to be possible to actually sue vaccine manufacturers, and health authorities would want to give people assurances that in the case of injury, the government would not feed them to the wolves. The coronavirus vaccination drive very notorious refused to even consider this in any way. The reasons why are obvious - when there were fatalities in the 1976 swine flu scare from vaccination, vaccination stopped immediately, and a lot of people lost trust in pharma, especially after it came out there was no swine flu. Obviously Reagan comes in and says you can no longer sue vaccine manufactures because muh free market, and that's where distrust of vaccines increases - and also where the schedule of forced vaccinations steps up dramatically, using the schools as the point of coercion.

Not only did the corona vax exaggerate everything that made people distrustful of vaccines, but the governments went out of their way to burn any trust they might have had as the vaccines rolled out, and went out of their way to make the vaccines a political issue - which they had to do because of their ulterior motives and what the corona crisis was really intended to do. It's like the government wanted this reaction, specifically to test how they could terrorize people - or because they wanted to see if they could force people to march to their death, unable to sue vaccine manufacturers or receive any compensation. The ethos of the government was that everyone was on their own.

I should also note that China did not compel vaccinations with anything like the outrageous policies the US, Canada, and Europe were doing. China, dictatorial where the Party invented the lockdown strategy, didn't mandate vaccinations by threatening to take away peoples' jobs and welfare benefits if they didn't comply. The CCP, whatever you may say about them, understand the need of getting people to trust the government at least a little bit. Everything about the occidental countries was about grinding people into compliance - less because of the vaccine even, and more to set the precedent that governments can make you do literally anything, because they sought to change the form of government in those countries to an overly fascist government, and the mandates were about scrapping the parts of liberalism they didn't want any more.

>>454525
So all the arguments I made are inadmissible to your thinking. It's only natural selection (which is a perfect system guaranteeing eugenics) or artificial selection (which is idealized as the deliberate practice of eugenics on the same principle). No other thought-form or answer to a situation is possible. The only answer eugenics has is more eugenics. This is how eugenics works by design, and it is not a matter of simple ignorance or hypocrisy. It's an intention to reach an ideal political form of society that eugenics has in mind, and that form in fascism.

Note that eugenics, by its nature, is intensely idealist and holds its system above the world. It can only envision a total society controlling all things, and that is the goal of any eugenics - total command and control. They are singularly obsessed with this goal, and that is why true believers in the eugenic creed take a consistent form in their crusade. Eugenism is a simplistic but very malevolent thought-form which degrades any society and any human being it touches. The ultimate goal of eugenics is less about the supposed end state of race betterment, but a constant pressing of a nerve to create in the eugenic believer the mental state appropriate to their moral theory and the social form a eugenicist aristocracy desires. It just so happens that such an arrangement would place a new aristocracy at the top of the world forever.

Orwell wasn't writing about the future. He was threatening the plebs with something that was already alive in his time, and telling them that this menace was something different than what it was, and that the actual "Ingsoc" was supposed to be the friendly socialism that stopped the world from becoming Oceania.

Maybe on some level, Orwell was very aware of what he was writing, and he dropped enough hints that suggested the truth - making very specific allusions to Fabian socialism in Ingsoc's social engineering goals, and presenting Ingsoc as something very clearly in the British imperial tradition of thinking. But I think it likely that the hints were accidental, or inevitable given that the world of Ingsoc implies that something like eugenism would have taken hold as the ruling idea of the Party, whether Orwell knew the concept in those terms or not.

>>454564
Hello Liberal Party propagandist.

>>454564
>>454565
Prof Wolff's take on Truckers and Covid

>>454580
They trucker protests are, infact, incredibly cringe tho.

>>454581
Class struggle is cringe to you?
Just admit you don't care about the proletariat

>>454583
>A bunch of retarded petty Bourgeois burgers and labor aristocrats being upset at basic human decency is class struggle.


How far adrift we are at sea with no sign of a search party.

>>454584
>>A bunch of retarded petty Bourgeois burgers and labor aristocrats being upset at basic human decency is class struggle.
see >>454436
I want to know what the fuck have you done that's better. Internet leftists hating on the protests like you just come off as privileged fucks who don't know what its like to work hard. It's pretty fucking repulsive to see leftists being down with medical apartheid and mass firings over the covid spook. Just a reminder that you're on the same side as the big banks, the cops and the settler colonialist government

>>454589
My very existence is more than that gaggle of retards you are sucking off has ever done. I work 60 hour weeks in a factory, kid, sorry, but, those truckers are retards and if the left is that desperate to latch on to any movement then we are dead in the water.

P.S: Covid is real, vaccines work, masks work and you are a retard.

>>454591
>I work 60 hour weeks in a factory, kid,
Bitch and you're telling me you wouldn't protest if the government started threatening to fire you from your job? And like 1/3 of the twitter left and 1/2 of the left on youtube and org support it btw

>>454591
>vaccines work
No they don't lol, 2020 vaccines are like 30% effective today. Imagine supporting segregation policies targeting workers who aren't buying into the medical bourgeoisie's commodity fetishism and calling yourself a leftist

>>454594
Your position is literally "I want these workers fired for not wearing the same brand as me" except its corporate medication they're not taking. And the 30% rate is the fact that even medical bureaucrats are admitting, or are they only right when they agree with you

>>454596
You had no argument from the beginning you just went straight to name calling
>When did I say I want anyone to be fired for not wearing a mask?
You want them fired for not taking the vax
>inb4 "I don't"
Then why are you going out of your way to demonize and slander protesters struggling to keep their jobs

>>454596
>Nope, flat out lie. Stop lying. Cope. There's a reason no one with a vaccine actually dies.
Your really a clown my guy, your the reason average people look down on the left

>>454591
Bahahaha imagine siding with Big Pharma over truckers and still calling yourself a communist.

>>454605
You fucking retards: You're siding with capitalism as an economic system. Anyone who uses the term "big pharma" is just using the gay frog conspiracy theory version of IDpol and needs to read a fucking book


Pharmaceutical companies in and of themselves are not the Issue (more is a product produced by them inherently bad) the issue is an economic system of production which was fucking annihilated by this pandemic and interruptions like mandates and sickness have only ground the system even further to a halt.


You're just as bad as every liberal begging for the system to return to normal so they can go back to their blind and ignorant/naive consumption.

Stupid.

The truckers had the same financial sanctions put on them as Russia just got. They are using all the societal mechanisms of control they built up to try and cancel Putin. Russia and the truckers are being treated the same way, they are brothers in the anti-imperialist struggle

>>454614
We need to purge these skitzos.

>>454606
>You fucking retards: You're siding with capitalism as an economic system
Who, leftists supporting this or some trucker you singled out? You can still support a movement and be critical of it's members
>Anyone who uses the term "big pharma"
Oh no we offended the snowflake
>was fucking annihilated by this pandemic and interruptions like mandates and sickness have only ground the system even further to a halt.
See >>454614 the bourgeois state can sacrifice profits to strengthen authoritative powers and control to preserve capitalism
>You're just as bad as every liberal begging for the system to return to normal
You're doing that by opposing the protests, "normal" is what the ruling class chooses and it has consistently been vax mandates and profiling. Regulations have been mainly used to suppress working class political action (banning meetings, enforcing a curfew and giving the police more power while bourgeois officials can disobey restrictions without any consequences)

>>454618
Unless you can retort to me in full and not cherry pick me then you have no room to call anyone a snowflake

>>454618
>See >>454614 the bourgeois state can sacrifice profits to strengthen authoritative powers and control to preserve capitalism
confirmed for didn't even read the article lmao

>>454606
Pharmaceutical companies are definitely an issue when you're forced to buy their product at gunpoint and your life becomes even more unlivable if you don't comply with tyrannical dictates. At some point though you have to ask if it is reducible to a company's bottom line or if there is something more sinister, an alliance between corporate and state power towards direct aims. Pfizer doesn't exactly need more money by making you get more vaccines - they can get their revenue stream simply by state procurement contracts, and it's only a pretense that any of this is a service to you the person receiving injections. It's been clear that the "vaccine" is intended for some purpose other than helping you with anything, so much that the vaccine is practically worthless at what it ostensibly is there to do. There is also the precedent set of biological public health security overriding constitutional law or any court or democratic process. This event has been a dry run of dictatorial government, very conspicuously so. A democratic debate has been completely foreclosed in the making of policy - and it must be remembered that this policy is crafted by basically a few people connected to the top of the oligarchy. The people lower in the hierarchy, who work with national or provincial governments, have often seemed to me like they're being forced to go along with something they're not confident in, while the true believers have stuck to the most strident line. Any time the covid restrictions did go before democratic debate, there have been reservations or open calls to relax the mandates, or at least restore some sanity to what is clearly a process driven by a few well-connected people and institutions. A lot of this opposition is theatrical - they probably figured out quickly that this was the new normal and they were going to suck it - but there's a reason obviously tyrannical mandates have been periodically rescinded or relaxed, and threats to fine people into oblivion were cancelled at the last minute because it was such an obviously batshit and evil policy that would harm more people than the supercold.

>>454629
No one is forcing you to buy anything at gun point you melodramatic faggot. Everything that you fear was shot down by the supreme court and yet you still go on this skitzophrenic tirades denouncing the one thing that can keep people from fucking dying. Fuck your skitzophrenia and fuck your denialism about actual existing shit that actually is killing millions of people you worthless faggot I'd beat the absolute shit out of you if you were standing directly in front of me. You are solely responsible for the continued march and existence of capitalism through your credulous service to it and keep people fucking docile and fucking stupid.

Kill you're

>>454630
Your self*

>>454630
The entire covid op is there to preserve oligarchic rule and make the rich richer. The rich voted themselves free money and made us basically accept them as winners for doing nothing at all.

>>454634
Thw rich give themselves breaks every time there is a crisis you half wit. That doesn't make a pandemic not really.

You pathetic fags will find any excuse to shit your petulant little pants over covid

>>454612
I like this analysis

>>454640
I'm sorry but you're a fucking retard.

>>454634
>The rich voted themselves free money and made us basically accept them as winners for doing nothing at all.
It's been always like that, the pandemic didn't cause this.
Check out this
>>454568

>>454645
Not only that but their logic doesn't make any sense. It's fucking economic idpol; Oh this one company is bad so there for X is bad.
Rather than understanding the system as a whole is fucked and it has nothing to do with one company.

Furthermore, it doesn't make any sense because the pandemic brought the machine to a halt.

Is the pandemic really over?
>Biden’s State of the Union speech marked the climax of a weeks-long effort of the entire political establishment and corporate media to force the American population to “live with the virus” and accept a “new normal” of unending mass infections, debilitation and deaths.
https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2022/03/03/pers-m03.html

The American ruling class factions and that includes the CDC are now trying their best to convince people that pandemic is over, and that they need to get on with their lives in accordance with vaccination and herd immunity. Of course all this is happening at a time when infections and death are occurring at far greater pace then before and on top of that the threat of new emerging variants is becoming more discernible in many parts of the world. All this coincides with creating the climate of confrontation and war against Russia. Now more then ever the task of international working class is to put an end to both the pandemic and War.

>>454640
putin is not our friend, he's an actor.

>>454630
denialism about actual existing shit that actually is killing millions of people
that's exactly what you're doing, fag

>>454683
What the fuck does this even mean? Are you about to claim that the vaccines not COVID is what is killing millions? Lmao

>>454650
>death are occurring at far greater pace then before
What is your basis for thinking this?

>>454690
Do you live under a rock?

>>454699
>Do you live under a rock?
Not an argument. If you have evidence to back up your claim then show it.

>>454705
Literally turn on a TV you retard.

>>454706
>Literally turn on a TV
The TV says covid is over and we all need to worry about russa now.

>>454707
Did you miss the 1mill deaths mile stone or something? You're just Chery picking.

>>454708
>Did you miss the 1mill deaths mile stone or something?
I saw no such thing. Even Biden's state of the union address barely mentioned covid.

> You're just Chery picking.
It is difficult to do cherry picking with the zero evidence you have provided so far.

>>454711
You're literally just ignoring reality lmfao. 960mill have died. COPE

>>454719
>You're literally just ignoring reality lmfao.
If it is true then you should have no problem posting evidence.

>>454720
Literally go to fucking Google and type in the number of deaths.

But it doesn't even matter cause you will just complain about Google.

So go to duck duck go and look up the number of deaths.
But you will just back track on that too because you're a midwit with a bias.

>>454732
You made the claim so you find the evidence.
If you can't find the evidence then what you said it wrong.

Omicron BA.2 subvariant fuels new global surge of the pandemic
>Contrary to the narrative spun by the corporate media that COVID-19 is now “endemic” and a stable “new normal” has been reached, reality has come crashing down once again in the third year of this unprecedented crisis.
https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2022/03/09/pers-m09.html

Humanity is facing multiple wars in parallel. The COVID biological war, the economic war waged by the capitalist class worldwide against workers and the impending global war which may escalate into a nuclear conflict leading to a human and environmental disaster.

COVID nefarious intent has been massive population reduction. It appears that has not resulted in significant deaths worldwide. The capitalists plan B is economic warfare to cause widespread suffering and death. They are even contemplating a nuclear holocaust to save capitalism from its internal and explosive contradictions, by killing millions more globally.

It is more evident now capitalism has been causing and aggravating these wars on all fronts in pursuit of obscene accumulation of capital and excessive exploitation of nature and the working class.

The most common denominator and potent weapon of capitalists have used in their wars are not their F35s, war ships, submarines, satellites or its internal security apparatus, but its overwhelming propaganda to indoctrinate and dominate. Thus, the ideological and information battlefields are the most strategic areas where effective tactics must be deployed to demystify capitalism and mobilize the working class to put an end to a system that is leading humanity to its demise. WSWS has been instrumental and persistent in denouncing the ruthless machinations of capitalism by offering alternative narrative.

>>454743
Your first claim was that there are a million deaths. This graph does not show that.
Your second claim was that the pandemic is not over. Again, this graph does not show that.

Even with hospital prokies inflating covid deaths to get more funding, the deaths now are insignificantly low. Remember 1000s of people die everyday from car accidents and other illnesses. If you're expecting zero deaths to call the pandemic over then that's never going to happen.

China mounts all-out effort to stop the spread of Omicron BA.2 subvariant
>Backed by popular support for the Zero-COVID policy that has continuously prevented infections and deaths, the Chinese government is mobilizing vast resources to quell the outbreak and save lives.
https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2022/03/16/pers-m16.html

The authorities in China are seen once again taking draconian measures for the sake of stopping the spread of Omicron Ba.2 subvariant. While these steps are necessary for the safety of the people, but it would be a challenge to return to normal conditions at a time when Western bourgeois governments have dismantled all safety measures. The ongoing pandemic and the explosive geopolitical situation due to the war situation in Ukraine has created rampant inflation and economic instability at the global level. At the same time, however this toxic environment as the author pointed out is provoking Class struggle which had been contained for decades.

there's literally no proofs that zero covid works and the numbers aren't cooked

>>454800
That's not how the burden of proof works.
You have to prove that the numbers ARE cooked.
If I told you you can't "prove I can't fly when you aren't looking" you wouldn't believe I could fly would you?

>>454801
Because these are impossible numbers.
Language barrier prevents me from inquiring further, but for such insanely low numbers some form of validation is in order.

>>454802
I don't understand what's so hard to understand about COVID policy; Virus's attack our RNA and DNA and are spread through mucus found in coughing. Seems like common sense to me.

>>454805
ok nice
china numbers are impossible, simple as

>>454814
Oh you mean literally zero? I think that so what they are getting at this; Yeah zero is technically impossible but doing everything in our power to approach that maximum is what's important. I don't think it's meant to be taken literally.

Reading about the recent rise in excess deaths. 18% increase in non covid related deaths in Wales, and the increase follows mass vaccination of the population. It seems the truth is starting to come out.

>>455727
I doubt it has anything to do with the vaccines. Some explainations I've seen is that a bunch of people weren't treated for other diseases, and people with weak health got pushed into the grave by a COVID infection.
The truth about the deaths and how they relate to the vaccine is probably actually scarier. That the vaccines simply supress symptoms and don't protect you from damage caused by the virus like a true vaccine would.

>>455727
Kek. Kill yourself retard

>>455731
I actually agree about the fact that there are various causes of excess deaths but I am convinced that the vaccines are not as safe as even the majority of leftypol seems to believe. They do not want to publish the numbers directly either, and pfizer is trying to release vaccination data as slowly as possible.

It's basically a piece of software that "runs" using protiens. The delivery mechanism was validated but the piece of code it delivers is not necessarily "bug free" to make that analogy.

I wish it was all more transparent, but then you have libs like the guy above me who just shut down discussion lol

>>455821
>They don't want to post the numbers and are releasing data as slowly as possible.

Proof? How do you know that?

>>455821
They developed that vaccine in about a year or so, usually it takes ten years to get a vaccine ready. So it's likely that they cut a lot of corners on avoiding side effects. The vaccine also didn't really block the infection from spreading or make people completely immune.

I'm guessing that rushing it lowered the quality. Most people think that the side effects of catching the virus unvaxinated would have worse side effects. That's the calculation.

>>>455824
Yeah that anon is correct, they are not exactly forthcoming with data.

>>455833
We have been developing vaccin s for decades now. It's really not surprising that we can design one in such a quick amount of time and this does not prove that they are not safe to use in and of itself. You are worried about literally nothing.

The vaccine keeps people from dying fool. Not from spreading. The only way to stop spreading is to isolate and wear a mask when out in public. Vaccines can stop spreading though because they cut the half life of infection time down by half. People with out vaccines can be contagious for months but people with vaccines stop being contagious with in 10 - 15 again wrong.

>>455847
>We have been developing vaccin s for decades now. It's really not surprising that we can design one in such a quick amount of time
OK sure but usually vaccines take about 10 years to finish.

>and this does not prove that they are not safe to use in and of itself.
There is not enough data being released to really say but there are indications that the Ronavaxines have a higher than normal level of side effects (compared to other vaccines). It's still better to get vaccinated, because the side effects from Corona are worse but you have to be honest about these things.

>The vaccine keeps people from dying fool.
That is great
>Not from spreading.
But you kinda do want a vaccine to also stop the spread completely and make the virus go extinct. This protects people who can't get vaccinated for medical reasons, potential unlucky people whose immune system didn't respond to the vaccines, and the "civilization skeptics". By killing off the virus you also stop mutated versions of the virus from coming back sometime in the future.

>The only way to stop spreading is to isolate and wear a mask when out in public
Mechanically filtering air to block Virus particles, is of course the most effective, cost efficient and least risky way to extinct a virus. However we need better societal coordination for that.

>>455849
>in such a quick amount of time
OK sure but usually vaccines take about 10 years to finish.

Yeah but we don't usually have a globe spanning pandemic on our hands. The vaccine basically works the same as all other vaccines minus a few experimental methods. If you understand anything about genealogy; I don't see what you are afraid of. This sounds like the same perk clutching I hear from "anti gmo" advocates.


>There is not enough data being released to really say but there are indications that the Ronavaxines have a higher than normal level of side effects (compared to other vaccines). It's still better to get vaccinated, because the side effects from Corona are worse but you have to be honest about these things.

Let me ask you: What would be an adequate amount of data for you? Like what in your opinion is enough data and in what time span?
Further more again just because there are side effects doesn't mean they are life threatening or that there will be worse side effects down the road. There's side effects with all vaccines. I got slightly sick with a fever of 99° when. I got my first vaccine. I left work went home slept and the next day I was good. Having actual COVID is much much worse I assure you.

>But you kinda do want a vaccine to also stop the spread completely and make the virus go extinct.

It took polio decades to go extinct. Also you kind of Cherry picked this cause I explained how it does stop spreading by lowering exposure time.



This protects people who can't get vaccinated for medical reasons, potential unlucky people whose immune system didn't respond to the vaccines, and the "civilization skeptics".

A very marginal part of the population to an irrelevant degree. Most people who say they can get shots are lying

>>455824
First article on google:

<the US Food and Drug Administration (FDA) has slowly started to release Pfizer COVID-19 vaccine data to the public – something that they had originally wanted until 2096 to do.

https://euroweeklynews.com/2022/03/08/fda-pfizer-vaccine-data/

>>455851
Archive of the article before that shit gets memory holed.
https://web.archive.org/web/20220804041418/https://euroweeklynews.com/2022/03/08/fda-pfizer-vaccine-data/

>>455851
So other than the fact that this is a very obviously bias news outlet what makes you think the vaccine will have negative side effects? Furthermore why do you think that the benefits of vaccinating people when millions and millions of people have died globally because of COVID is not worth the risk of some side effects? What makes you think the side effects will be bad?

Guarantee that nothing substantial will come.over thos and this is just more conspiracy moon land is fake fear mongering.

>>455847
>>455860
>the vaccine keeps people dying

It might keep people from dying from covid, but with medicine you must be able to show that the following statement is true:

<you live longer after doing this treatment

So if you survive covid but die earlier from other side-effects the risk-benefit analysis changes. I believe they made this a standard when a cancer treatment was tested that killed the cancer but also the patient.

I don't think they have adequately shown this.

For one thing it highly depends on your age group, and also the benefit vs risk analysis changes with each mutation of the virus.

If you have the CDC pushing kids to get boosters that literally makes no sense to me since children rarely have serious issues from covid.

>>455850
>Let me ask you: What would be an adequate amount of data for you?

They should not be trying to delay any of the data on the vaccines. Second during the early release and push for vaccines there was an understanding that it would prevent transmission and the pandemic would end. They knew that wasn't the case.

This completely undermines my trust regarding the whole government response to covid. You have so many lies from the government and its media: lies about natural immunity not being effective which turned out to not be true, lies about asymptomatic infections, lies about the viability of other already available drugs' effectiveness of fighting covid, they even basically admitted that it came from a lab (not saying intentionally leaked but it was dismissed as crazy conspiracy at first):

https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2021/10/nih-admits-funding-risky-virus-research-in-wuhan


I know that if you're relatively young and healthy then covid, even then original variant of it was not a big deal for the numerous people that I know that have had it. So why did I get vaccinated? If I knew what I know now I wouldn't have got it. If you aren't letting people make informed decisions, pushing the vaccine onto the population, that isn't medicine. That's something else.

I think there's a certain amount of cognitive dissonance going on where it's difficult to accept that even the healthcare systems are out to fuck workers. They're supposed to be above that. It's also harder to look at things critically if you've already taken the vaccine.

>>455860
>what makes you think the vaccine will have negative side effects?

Well this is just an unarguable fact, here's a safety report from germany that lists the variety of side effects that have happened. I mean it's up to you to asses the risk of course but there is a risk.

>>455918
>>455918
Yeah but the ones is on you to prove the vaccines have negative side effects which you can't. You can only complain about not liking the time from the government released it on and you're getting your wish anyways and as I said the data will 100% show there are no sever long-term adverse side effects. You have nothing but hot air. vaccine denialism has always been nonsense all the way up to the quack nutcase who started all this discordance. What an absolute joke.

>>455931
Did you see this?
>>455921

Now you might say I accept these chances of getting these side effects if the benefit is not dying of covid. But are you old and diabetic?

Instead of getting a booster I will take my chances with the latest variants. That's my bottom line. And pushing it onto kids is just wrong. And we will have to wait and see but I bet these vaccines are responsible for at least some of the rise in non-covid excess deaths. That's not denialism that's common sense and pragmatism.