/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

>>455660
>then arresting everyone that played a role in the conspiracy to undermine the USA's democracy
No shit democracy is rigged, democracy is just another form of bourgeois dictatorship. Trying to restore "US democracy" doesn't get rid of capitalism, call for revolution instead, the red terror is when the politicians and everyone who stands in our way are crushed.

>>455661
God, I am so tired of this nebulous ass double speak. Be specific in what you mean when you speak. There's plenty of different ideas about how democracy should function and not all of them are the same. What you mean is this specific historic bourgeois democracy.

>>455660
I don't know about technical details of control but yes in general, bourgeois democracy is very unlikely to let a representative of the proletarian class take state power willingly. That is what Marx meant with that it's always a dictatorship of one class or another.

I don't know if the group your call the tech-fascists are in control or not, but even without/before that the electoral system has always had a very strong tendency towards plutocracy, because it takes so much resources to run an election campaign. The plutocrats have deep pockets and can finance more electoralism.

About the communications interference, that didn't start in 1996, the ruling classes always made sure that their ideology was imposed on the population they rule over. None of this is really new.

It has been a civilizational battle to make reliable communication for millennia. We build something to transmit information and those that seek to manipulate perception try to interfere with it. It's not just the scammers it's also the ruling classes them self that tamper with communication.

Take a deep breath, this is a marathon. We have been at this for thousands of years. We want to document objective material reality and we want to transmit it as information to other people who are separated by time and space from that documented reality. And we want the information to contain an accurate reflection of reality. Our opponents want to insert bias and lies that serve their interests. Making up Bullshit is always faster than finding out the truth, but the truth has much greater staying-power, therefor we have to play the long game. Eventually we will be able to build systems that are resilient enough to counter all their Bullshit. But we have to be methodical, patient and relentless. It might take decades or even centuries but the General Intellect will eventually be free.

>>455662
I'm not pro-revolutionary to fix democracy, democracy cannot rip apart capitalism. A radical overthrow of ownership comes first before the setting up of political institutions. This thread is just stupid we don't have the power to stop US democracy being "undermined" even if we did why would we?

>>455664
Workers democracy is the goal of any revolutionary society though. That's what I meant when people arbitrarily lump the two together you pave the way for authoritarianism. Democracy as it exists today isn't democracy. It's republicanism where the workers vote on their masters every few years.

>>455665
Damn, I didn't know you spoke for every pro-revolutionary, fool.

>>455666
I didn't say that you cowardly retard. Read your theory before you open your mouth and sound like a retard.

>>455667
stfu democrat.

>>455666
Well what would you propose, workers lottocrcy, workers republic?
>>455667
Is that the only derogatory term you know? This isn't guilty gear, you cant just spam the same move, mix it up!

>>455669
Why would we propose anything like that when we have no power? Whatever would become of us happens after radical overthrow of ownership, only then can political institutions be set up. Make power explicit, then human beings can organize themselves accordingly.

>>455670
I should have said "I" not "we" I am only one person not a group.

>>455664
>This thread is just stupid we don't have the power to stop US democracy being "undermined" even if we did why would we?
The US political system of bourgeois dictatorship with 2 parties is destroying the US, and that will also destroy the last capitalist empire that could overthrow socialist countries. You could try to justify this with revolutionary defeatism, but consider that when the US empire croaks and you don't set up new political structures to pick up the slack beforehand half a continent will be thrown in to chaos. Nothing good ever comes out that kind of thing.
>>455669
>workers lottocracy
that means the same as sortition democracy right ?
based
>>455670
>Whatever would become of us happens after radical overthrow of ownership, only then can political institutions be set up. Make power explicit, then human beings can organize themselves accordingly.
You can set up political institutions even if you don't have power, as a training exercise to have it ready for when you need it.

>>455670
Welcome back brother. Haven't seen you here in a while.

>>455691
>The US political system of bourgeois dictatorship with 2 parties is destroying the US, and that will also destroy the last capitalist empire that could overthrow socialist countries. You could try to justify this with revolutionary defeatism, but consider that when the US empire croaks and you don't set up new political structures to pick up the slack beforehand half a continent will be thrown in to chaos. Nothing good ever comes out that kind of thing.
I don't care if the US is destroyed, when you tell me bourgeois democracy is destroying the US, I look back and say we can't do shit nor would I want to had I the choice. Helping US "democracy" doesn't destroy capitalism, it strengthens it. Which is not what I want, unless that is you're not pro-revolutionary.
>You can set up political institutions even if you don't have power
Your political institution won't give you experience, "training ", when you have no power over anyone or anything, a couple of your bohemians doesn't equal jack.