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/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

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 No.456195[Last 50 Posts]

It's now been confirmed that Darya Dugina, daughter of Russian political philosopher Alexander Dugin, has been assassinated in a car bombing in Moscow Oblast. Her father was supposed to be in the car, indicating that he was the target of the attack.

This has literally just happened and I will try to post updated news when I see it.
Link to the RWA twitter thread:
https://twitter.com/RWApodcast/status/1561101559974559744?s=20&t=L6HTiDXFLkuXXzBW7CSM1w
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 No.456196

File: 1661033220277.jpg (37.09 KB, 591x976, 7262829.jpg)

:'(
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 No.456197

>>456196
Sucks for these high ranking officials that they and their family won't be able to travel freely, even inside their own country without fear of assassination.

There are a lot of fluent Russian speaking Ukrainians who wants revenge against Putin and his cronies. They can probably get fake authentic Russian passport or use the actual passport being generously handed out by Russia like candies.

What's to say that Putin won't get sniped while relaxing outdoors even in the middle of nowhere in Siberia? Or maybe he might get RPG-7'ed while travelling inside his armored Limo? Or maybe a mortar shell might land inside his fortified home.
>>

 No.456198

The CIA can be pretty cool sometimes.
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 No.456199

>>456198
It's probably internal FSB fighting TBH.
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 No.456200

File: 1661098457800.mp4 (7.14 MB, 518x490, 1661047656403.mp4)

Tankies on suicide watch.
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 No.456201

>>456200
Based. Fuck tankies
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 No.456202

File: 1661105926652.gif (3.82 MB, 498x401, vaush-soy.gif)

>>456200
>>456201
So true bros. Slava Ukraini! Slava Azov! ACAB!
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 No.456203

File: 1661108103242.png (40.17 KB, 846x163, triggered.png)

>>456198
A Ztard got triggered by my post.
>>

 No.456204

Unfathomably based
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 No.456205

File: 1661108246313.gif (172.16 KB, 371x498, pepe-sing-peepo-sing.gif)

On top of this Caleb maupin has successfully been cancelled.

https://medium.com/@cpimembersspeakout/caleb-maupins-former-comrades-speak-out-his-abuses-must-stop-4167bc1c2c
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 No.456206

>>456203
>Not larping as the Soviet union and allowing free speech makes you NATO sympathizers.

Yassss queen.
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 No.456207

File: 1661108482597.mp4 (35.24 KB, 480x256, -swjJRxPqaIky7M1.mp4)

>>456204
>>456205
>>456206
samefag+glowie+kill yourself
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 No.456208

>>456207
KABLOOIE!
Too soon?
>>

 No.456209

>>456208
Why are you celebrating western intelligence alongside neo-nazis assassinating the family of an anti-imperialist academic? I just don't get it. It makes no sense to me.

What's the point of being a leftist if you'll sell out to porkie this easily?
>>

 No.456210

>>456207
Cope seethe dial8
>>

 No.456211

File: 1661108983294.jpeg (7.47 KB, 213x237, download (6).jpeg)

>>456209
Anti imperialist academic?
Dugin literally believes in Russian Catholic Monarchism and Russian Nationalism you retard. His daughter echoed her fathers views. That's why idiot.
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 No.456212

File: 1661109534860.jpg (141.52 KB, 1280x610, 20220808_070822.jpg)

>>456211
>Dugin literally believes in Russian Catholic Monarchism
>Russian CATHOLIC Monarchism
Jesus Christ at least use basic fucking logic when trying to slander him.
>Russian Nationalism
Under current material conditions russian nationalism is anti-imperialism. Geopolitical realities mean that to exert Russia's influence Putin needs to support anti-imperialist states like Nicaragua, Cuba, Venezuela, South Africa, Syria, Iran, India etc. I mean, just look at who's backing Ukraine; UK, France, USA, Germany, Japan, ISRAEL! Multipolarity helps us fight for socialism, supporting terrorist acts by the CIA does the opposite.
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 No.456213

File: 1661110127816.jpg (629.66 KB, 1140x655, bannan.jpg)

>>456209
>Why are you celebrating western intelligence alongside neo-nazis
Don't forget the Joker, Satan and the guy who always ties women to railroad tracks were involved too.
>assassinating the family of an anti-imperialist academic?
Yes, resurrecting orthodox christian tsarism is anti-imperialism.
>What's the point of being a leftist if you'll sell out to porkie this easily?
A recovering /pol/yp like you wouldn't know the first thing about being a socialist.
>>

 No.456214

>>456212
>>Russian CATHOLIC Monarchism
>Jesus Christ at least use basic fucking logic when trying to slander him.
Oh shit! You got him on a semantic argument, well played ztard, well played.
>Under current material conditions russian nationalism is anti-imperialism. Geopolitical realities mean that to exert Russia's influence Putin needs to support anti-imperialist states like Nicaragua, Cuba, Venezuela, South Africa,
These are states that Russia has no hope of imperializing.
>I mean, just look at who's backing Ukraine; UK, France, USA, Germany, Japan,
Niqqa the whole world in the UN voted to sanction Russia over this.
>ISRAEL!
Real mask off moment there recovering /pol/yp.
>Multipolarity
Holy shit, you guys are still on this?! There is no multipolarity, Russia a paper tiger.
Your invasion caused NATO to dramatically expand more within a year than it had in 20.
China will also prove to be a paper tiger because most of their shit is based off of Russian gear.
We're going back to a unipolar world without even the pretense of even another pole thanks to you ztards.
>>

 No.456215

>>456212
>No Ukrainian civilians in that pic.
Right, because Ukrainians don't want to be middle class like the rest of the EU kek.
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 No.456216

File: 1661111381270.jpg (443.66 KB, 828x1045, 20220405_173738.jpg)

>>456213
>resurrecting orthodox christian tsarism is anti-imperialism
Very dangerous thinking anon. Using that logic, as leftists we should be arguing for the CIA overthrowing governments like in Iran and Gaza because they are "reactionaries reviving fundamentalist Islam". We could also end up supporting imperialist acts such as the Clinton administration's bombing of Serbia because "Milošević was reviving Serbian nationalism" to whatever.

They tried to kill Dugin because he has spent his life fighting American liberalism and imperialism, which has often meant working alongside communists and socialists. To celebrate his attempted assassination is what I would expect from reddit social fascists (as they are currently doing), not /leftypol/ Marxists.
>A recovering /pol/yp like you wouldn't know the first thing about being a socialist.
Only been on that board a few times in my life actually. Can we stay on topic anyway.
>>

 No.456217

>>456215
What do you mean? Are you saying that Ukraine would be better off in the EU or something?
The EU's purpose is to make the working class of eastern europe nations poorer, while enriching the northern European capitalists. Bulgaria has been in the EU for 15 years and is poorer than Russia while their population has also declined by over 25%.
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 No.456218

>>456216
>Very dangerous thinking anon.
Only for people that don't understand theory.
>Using that logic, as leftists we should be arguing for the CIA overthrowing governments like in Iran and Gaza because they are "reactionaries reviving fundamentalist Islam".
I'm sorry, what countries are Iran and kekekekekek GAZA, invading right now?
>We could also end up supporting imperialist acts such as the Clinton administration's bombing of Serbia because "Milošević was reviving Serbian nationalism" to whatever.
Do you have anymore imaginary whataboutisms?
>They tried to kill Dugin because he has spent his life fighting American liberalism and imperialism,
Who is "they", why do you assume it was the West that did this. Putin kills dissidents all the time.
>which has often meant working alongside communists and socialists.
Holy shit, Dugin was not a communist or a socialist. Please shut up.
>To celebrate his attempted assassination is what I would expect from reddit social fascists
>Muh Reddit
You tankies are the one's that joke about gulags and "facing the wall" all the time and NOW you wanna be all civil over the death of some shill LMAO.
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 No.456219

>>456217
>What do you mean? Are you saying that Ukraine would be better off in the EU or something?
Yes, especially when they replace Russia as the EU's primary oil supplier.
>The EU's purpose is to make the working class of eastern europe nations poorer, while enriching the northern European capitalists.
It didn't make Poland poorer. I'm perfectly aware the neoliberalism of the EU, but that is by no means a given if Ukraine joins. If you wanna criticize the EU, by all means, but to say they'd be better off under a dysfunctional Russia is laughable.
>Bulgaria has been in the EU for 15 years and is poorer than Russia while their population has also declined by over 25%.
Niqqqa the Russia Federation has some of the highest wealth inequality, addiction and poverty in all of the fucking world.
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 No.456220

>>456218
>I'm sorry, what countries are Iran and kekekekekek GAZA, invading right now?
Iran is militarily involved in Syria and Iraq. Without Iranian arms and funding the Houthis and Hezbollah wouldn't be such powerful forces either. Anyway, this line of reasoning is pointless unless you're suggesting that Dugin deserves to be killed because of Russia's invasion of Ukraine? Which for one, it's idealist bullshit to imply that Dugin has had ANY influence at all on that happening.

Also I purposely said governments not states. Gaza is currently ruled by Hamas, an Islamic fundamentalist group. Come on man, you've got to at least know this one lmao.
>Do you have anymore imaginary whataboutisms?
It's not whataboutism. Many "leftists" at the time used that line of thinking to justify their support for NATO in Yugoslavia. If you're fighting alongside Bill Clinton and Tony Blair, you're probably fighting on the wrong side.
>Who is "they", why do you assume it was the West that did this.
"They" being the intelligence agencies of the USA and their sidekicks MI6. Probably 90% of what the Ukrainian government does is dictated by these two groups.
>Putin kills dissidents all the time.
Highly unlikely that this was Putin. Dugin has been extremely supportive of Putin recently and it's unlikely Putin would try (and fail) to take out a dissident in such a public way that has the political ramifications of a car bombing in Moscow. What happened will be perceived as a failure of the Russian security services and reflects very badly on Putin.
>You tankies are the one's that joke about gulags and "facing the wall" all the time and NOW you wanna be all civil over the death of some shill LMAO.
Problem?
>>

 No.456221

>>456197
>Sucks for these high ranking officials that they and their family won't be able to travel freely, even inside their own country without fear of assassination.
Dugin isn't a high ranking official though, he's an intellectual with B-celebrity level fame in Russia, he only got famous in the west because radlibs started to obsess about him. He isn't a mastermind shaping history from behind the scenes, he is just a dude who sells books and gives speeches.

>There are a lot of fluent Russian speaking Ukrainians who wants revenge
Ukraine is under extreme levels of censorship and political repression atm. Democracy was officially abandoned when they outlawed all opposing political parties and became an open dictatorship for imperial capital. That will break down and once Ukrainians realize that they were a pawn for US imperial ambitions, they probably won't let them self being used like that anymore, even if they don't like the Russians

I think the broader context you are talking about, are those 70% of US/EU weapons shipments that never made it to the battlefronts. The speculation is now that these weapons were funneled towards asymmetric warfare cells that are meant to use it for terror/guerilla warfare. IF this speculation is true, i wouldn't expect much, a big chunk of these weapons probably were sold on black markets. The Ukrainian population probably has war fatigue by now and they won't support an insurrection, and the flat terrain of Ukraine isn't as well suited for this type of warfare compared to places like Afghanistan
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 No.456222

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>>456219
>Yes, especially when they replace Russia as the EU's primary oil supplier.
Ukraine couldn't "replace" Russia as Europe's oil supplier any more than Norway or the UK could. Dream on.
>It didn't make Poland poorer.
Poland become Europe's cheap labour reserve when they joined the EU. They've been exploited to shit and have got crumbs in return. This like saying that European imperialism didn't make Africa poorer.
>I'm perfectly aware the neoliberalism of the EU, but that is by no means a given if Ukraine joins.
Lmao what is Ukraine going to change? Maybe we will get a Bandera statue outside the European Parliament but they will continue being Western Europe's primary source of cheap agricultural workers and prostitutes. Any development Ukraine gets will purely be to counter Russia and strengthen the ruling class of Ukraine (who are all psychotic fascists btw).
>but to say they'd be better off under a dysfunctional Russia is laughable.
"dysfunctional" russia is currently surviving being sanctioned by most of the world's largest economies while all EU member states are suffering with inflation, gas shortages and looming recession. Don't fall for the flashy EU neoliberal propaganda, we're about to witness what Marx predicated would happen to European capitalism (again).
>Niqqqa the Russia Federation has some of the highest wealth inequality, addiction and poverty in all of the fucking world.
And this is also true in all of Eastern Europe after the fall of communism. The difference is that Russia is one of the few post-soviet states still opposing NATO and global capital.
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 No.456223

File: 1661115205462.jpg (192.55 KB, 1008x1017, halloween.jpg)

It just dawned on me why tankies, goons, Russian Nationalist and shills are taking her death so hard and uncharacteristically demanding reverence for her death (couldn't have cared less about all the civilians and soldiers Russia killed).

It's because her death makes them realize that propagandists like themselves are on the playing board now. These sycophants which I can only call basement dwellers (because they are so out of touch that they didn't see this coming) thought of themselves as above the fray. Since they were "thought leaders" and never bloodied their hands personally, they believed themselves beyond the material consequences of the politics they espoused.

But just like judges or other intelligentsia they are in fact pillars of Russian imperialist superstructure, and are now being seen by the state as such.

For many years from the 90's to about 2008 the internet was seen as something ephemeral, outside of the real world. This view lead the average person to see the internet and especially internet culture, as something impotent. This was taken advantage of by misanthropes and unsurprisingly you see the rise of some of the most pernicious and toxic cultures like imageboard and goon culture arise during this period. Conducting raids, and canceling people with little consequence because people still didn't think the internet was something that could hurt them, but their reach was unimaginably far and they could wield the influence of a newspaper mongol.

This lead to these maladjusted people to believe themselves invincible jesters "telling the truth" and that the public has some moral obligation to uphold this current state of affairs. You can see this entitlement in the persecution complex in both 4chan's /pol/ and leftypol.org's users whenever something even mildly inhibits them and they violently lash out with fedjacketing and bans to censor critics and opponents.

But around 2008 the smartphone revolution began and people's lives have been continually turned upside by the internet ever since. I'd say as late as 5 years ago the average person no longer saw the internet as a technical abstraction, but something as real to them as running water and electricity.

But these twats for some reason never got the memo. They continued to act with impunity antagonizing and harassing others as they saw fit.

For whatever reason, the state seems to have decided to start taking material actions against them. And their logic unassailable. These shills provide critical social capital to the politics they support, often giving the appearance of a general consensus on something when there often isn't one, discouraging critics and the undecided from challenging their views. But they receive next to no support from the state or orgs they are shilling for,in other words they DO IT FOR FREE.

They are the softest of soft targets. So the risk to attacking them is quite small, while the soft power that is destroyed is quite large. These internet trolls have grown fat and soft on the superior understanding of social media and internet social spaces they've wielded for 20 years and now are going to have to bleed for their beliefs just like old fashioned provocateurs did in the past.

I think you're going to start to see an increase in attacks against pro-Russian shills implicitly endorsed by the state. Not anything like a car bombing, but maybe a tankie's personal identity get accidentally leaked, and maybe when he gets beat up the police look the other way, things like that. Because regardless of what you think of Alexander Dugin's death, it was clearly done because of Dugin's ideology.

TL;DR Reactionary Russian chauvinists see Alexander Dugin as a harbinger for their own fates, and I think they're right.
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 No.456224

>>456222
>Ukraine couldn't "replace" Russia as Europe's oil supplier any more than Norway or the UK could. Dream on.
Yes it could, it has the biggest oil reserves in Europe discovered about duh duh duh, 2014, when Putin started his aggression against Ukraine in earnest.
>Poland become Europe's cheap labour reserve when they joined the EU. They've been exploited to shit and have got crumbs in return.
They are far better off economically then they were before their EU membership, even better than they were under the USSR, where they were a rump state and meat shield.
Like I said, look at how the average EU worker lives, and how the average Russian worker lives.
Also why do you tankies keep posting pictures of Lenin. Like I'm obligated to conform to his outdated "theory".
>>

 No.456225

>>456220
>Iran is militarily involved in Syria and Iraq.
Iran's military involvement was welcomed with open arms by Iraq during the ISIS incursion. Don't know about Syria but I didn't hear anything about them getting mired in a quagmire like Russia is in Ukraine so I doubt it's equivalent.
>>

 No.456226

>>456220
>It's not whataboutism. Many "leftists" at the time used that line of thinking to justify their support for NATO in Yugoslavia.
It is though, we're not talking about Yugoslavia. And this is nothing really like Yugoslavia. This is just plain old imperialist aggression on the flimsy pretext of "de-nazification" and the more substantial but still wildly unjustifiable attempt to stop NATO expansion.
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 No.456227

>>456223
Wow what an extremely convoluted way to say that glowies are based for killing people who you don't agree with. Anon the glowfags have been assassinating and arresting "anti-patriotic traitors" since the beginning of time, this come as a revelation to literally no-one. It's already a crime to openly be Z gang in most of europe, it's long been established that Ziggers can get I trouble for what they say.
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 No.456228

>>456227
>Wow what an extremely convoluted way to say that glowies are based for killing people who you don't agree with.
I guess you didn't read my post all the way through. You're supporting the brutalization of several million people over nothing.
You frustrate any real diplomatic solution the proletariat might be able to bring to bare on the situation with your slavish propagandizing. To put it in a way you might might understand, it's not so much that I think it's based it's that
YOU GET WHAT YOU DESERVE
also you clearly agree with my thesis and are shook
>>

 No.456229

>>456203
The Z-fags that are allowed and thriving over there has made me despise that place 10 times more than before.
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 No.456230

File: 1661116676512.jpg (32.21 KB, 670x335, polandinequalitydec2019fea….jpg)

>>456224
>Yes it could, it has the biggest oil reserves in Europe discovered about duh duh duh, 2014, when Putin started his aggression against Ukraine in earnest.
Hmmmmmmmmmm I wonder what else happened in Ukraine in 2014. You've neglected to mention another pretty significant foreign intervention in the country there buddy.
>They are far better off economically then they were before their EU membership, even better than they were under the USSR, where they were a rump state and meat shield.
If by "far better off economically" you mean the bourgeoisie has benefitted from massive deregulation, then sure I guess you're right.
<Within a single generation, Poland has gone from one of the most egalitarian countries in Europe to one of the most unequal
https://blogs.lse.ac.uk/europpblog/2019/12/02/within-a-single-generation-poland-has-gone-from-one-of-the-most-egalitarian-countries-in-europe-to-one-of-the-most-unequal/
>Like I said, look at how the average EU worker lives,
Significantly worse than they lived under communism, that's for sure. They work longer hours for a lower quality of life and less government protections. Neoliberalism has failed the working class, there's no debating this.
>and how the average Russian worker lives.
Also terribly. The difference is the Russian worked isn't working for international capital, who systematically exploit the global south and are currently the ones running the fucking world.
>>

 No.456231

>>456225
Okay, sure. Here's an interesting one: Iraq invading Kuwait in 1990. Was that an act of imperialism which justified the response it got? It sure is by your logic.
>>

 No.456232

>>456226
>This is just plain old imperialist aggression
The Ukrainian government in merely a puppet of the US. They have absolutely no sovereignty, no values and are willing to align with fascists in a heartbeat. Almost all of the territory Russia has taken insofar has been Russian speaking. To characterise it as an "imperialist war" on Russia's part is a huge oversimplification.
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 No.456233

>if you aren't angry that this literal who chick got killed you are a liberal and le nato shill
.org retards again showing their colors. The Russia ball-sucking really shows just how disgusting these type of leftists are.
>>

 No.456234

>>456230
Nibba, you're own article says that income inequality is way worse in Russia than it is in Poland. And while inequality was much better under the USSR in Poland the standard of living was infamously worse for those living behind the iron curtain.
ALSO
QUIT FUCKING BRINGING UP THE USSR, RUSSIA IS NOT THE USSR
Your OWN FUCKING ARTICLE says wealth inequity is worse in CURRENT day Russia than Poland, and that Poland has a substantial welfare state that mitigates this wealth inequality.
>By the same token, labour market liberalisation and privatisation during the transition instantly increased inequality and brought it to the level of countries with long histories of capitalism. On the other hand, a marked increase in social transfers and expansion of the safety net during the early transition years played a key role in ‘protecting’ the bottom 50% of the distribution. It provided the general political support for market reforms and enterprise restructuring in Poland.

>This contrasts with the Russian transition, as shown in the table above, where the share of the bottom 50% collapsed. Social transfer payments in Russia were small and declining, while pensions were not indexed for inflation, leading to a plunge in living standards of the bottom 50% when hyperinflation struck in the early 1990s. This suggests that mitigating a more substantial rise in inequality may be conducive to economic growth.

I'M TALKING ABOUT TODAY'S RUSSIA, NOT THE FAILED STATE THAT YOU TANKIES RAN INTO THE GROUND AND FORKED OVER TO THE INTERNATIONAL BOOJ WITHOUT A SINGLE SHOT BEING FIRED.
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 No.456235

Why should I care that this idiots daughter got exploded? I mean of course it would have been best had they both got the same treatment but that may come later for Dugin. What are the odds that the Russia nut-sack grabbing on .org and here is being done but literal Russia shills/trolls.
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 No.456236

>>456228
>You're supporting the brutalization of several million people over nothing.
This war started in 2014 with the Ukrainian Maiden government's fascist brutalisation of the Russian people of the Donbass and the murder of Communists in Odessa. This war isn't over "nothing", it's been years in the making.
>You frustrate any real diplomatic solution the proletariat might be able to bring to bare on the situation with your slavish propagandizing
Nah, I have been in support of a diplomatic solution since day 1. A solution that satisfies all parties involved, including the DPR and LNR. It's the Ukrainian government who's issuing ridiculous demand alike returning control of Crimea. It is in the interest of Porkie to drag this war on, using Ukraine and it's puppet government's dogmatic nationalism as a way to grind down the Russian military.
>also you clearly agree with my thesis and are shook
Anon it really wasn't that deep. If I get arrested or killed by my government, so be it. I know what the true nature of western "liberal democracy" looks like, very little can suprise me after I saw those pictures of abu ghraib tbh.
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 No.456237

>>456235
Well, if you've been a contrarian reactionary tankie shithead for the last several years you should care see >>456223
Otherwise you shouldn't care. Still an interesting story though. It has Putin written all over it. Remember that time he killed someone in plane view of a security cam in Moscow but the assassin did the hit behind the SINGLE street light on the road and therefore completely obscured what he did. It was like something out of a cartoon.
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 No.456238

>>456237
It does seem that way. Especially the "reverence" they don't get that not everybody is a total Russia shill. Maybe they get paid but the Russia state is looking in it's best interest and doesn't give a damn about these foreign simps.
>>

 No.456239

>>456233
I have been with leftychan since the split and post more here. Also if went this site to be successful on its own we need to stop constantly bringing up .org ffs
>>

 No.456241

>>456236
>This war started in 2014 with the Ukrainian Maiden government's fascist brutalisation of the Russian people of the Donbass and the murder of Communists in Odessa.
>Protests against Russian compilation to EU membership that lasted months, got many people hurt and arrested and were in sub-zero temperatures were the complete fabrication of the CIA and le Nazis.
Keep telling yourself that, can't wait to snitch on you to the Fed's when their inevitable tankie reeducation programs start kek.
>Nah, I have been in support of a diplomatic solution since day 1. A solution that satisfies all parties involved, including the DPR and LNR.
Aggressors like Russia are not legitimate parties.
>It's the Ukrainian government who's issuing ridiculous demand alike returning control of Crimea.
It's not ridiculous to return stolen property.
>Anon it really wasn't that deep. If I get arrested or killed by my government, so be it. I know what the true nature of western "liberal democracy" looks like, very little can suprise me after I saw those pictures of abu ghraib tbh.
I didn't say it was deep nimrod. And I won't believe any of your tough talk until I see some of your blood spilled, cause every tankie I've ever met is the biggest fucking suburbanite softie brainlet I've ever met. I know that's not necessarily true outside the west, but if a tankie can speak english fluently, they are always huge pussies talking shit.
>>

 No.456243

>>456239
I agree but it pertains to this thread imo because some of the Russia shills here are possibly the same ones from .org >>456203
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 No.456244

File: 1661118526227.png (229.94 KB, 674x379, 10f2708517ffdb06479748450a….png)

>>456234
The EU only maintains it high standard of living because of imperialism. France, Britain, Spain and Germany were colonial empires that plundered Africa and Asia for raw materials to fuel industry in their own countries. Eastern Europe never had this, and the region suffered greatly during the second world war. Do you really think that if it were only for capitalism eastern Europe would be better right now? It was capitalism which caused mass deindustrialization throughout Eastern Europe in the 1990s, forcing the workers to become a labour reserve for Western Europe.

If you truly think the EU is successful and a force for good you cannot call yourself a Marxist. I'm sorry.
>>

 No.456245

File: 1661119139548.png (17.02 MB, 3453x4604, ClipboardImage.png)

>>456223
Based post. Based taste. Elvira is the all-time GOAT big titty goth gf.
>"For they sow the wind, and they shall reap the whirlwind."
- Hosea 8:7
>>

 No.456246

>>456244
>The EU only maintains it high standard of living because of imperialism.
Not true, Europe's greatest worker concessions for Europeans' came AFTER WII when US hegemony took hold and Europe lost many of it's colonies.
>Eastern Europe never had this,
Poland has it now.
>and the region suffered greatly during the second world war.
And it suffered retarded economic growth after the 1960's under the USSR.
The only iron curtain country to have a semi modern economy was Yugoslavia which unsurprisingly fought off Russian hegemony.
>It was capitalism which caused mass deindustrialization throughout Eastern Europe in the 1990s, forcing the workers to become a labour reserve for Western Europe.
Quit talking about this as if the USSR were socialist. It wasn't. It was state capitalist. The Politburo owned all the capital, and the worker did not, which is why all the capital could be handed over to the booj when the USSR collapsed.
You can try to handwave it away with idealist copes like how the vanguard party WAS AKSHULLY THE WORKERS but I ain't falling for it.
>Do you really think that if it were only for capitalism eastern Europe would be better right now
<Oh boo hoo, Oh poor, poor Russia. Don't you know it's not fair to compare the EU to Russia
I don't give a fuck about Russia. The Ukrainians wanted to join the EU because they're richer. All your dumbass copes about NATO and imperialism don't matter to an average worker. Which is why your myths about DNR, Crimea, LNR just totally wanting to join Russia of their own volition make sense only to tankies.
>It was capitalism which caused mass deindustrialization throughout Eastern Europe in the 1990s,
Yes because they're were retardly capitalized. Eastern block products were of fucking laughable quality to even the lowest quality Western ones.
In a round about way yes it was capitalism, but it was really decades of inept management and capital reinvestment by tankies.
>>

 No.456247

File: 1661119338702.png (539.18 KB, 1280x720, ClipboardImage.png)

>>456228
Based and Joker-pilled
>>

 No.456248

>>456244
>If you truly think the EU is successful and a force for good you cannot call yourself a Marxist. I'm sorry.
If you think the EU is not more wealthy than Russia, and that joining it won't make you wealth while sitting on Texas sized oil reserves, then I'm sorry you have to call yourself retarded.
>>

 No.456249

File: 1661119478017.webm (6 MB, 672x1120, basedrus-3.webm)

>>456241
>Keep telling yourself that, can't wait to snitch on you to the Fed's when their inevitable tankie reeducation programs start kek.
Yeah, whatever man.
>Aggressors like Russia are not legitimate parties.
You accuse me of being opposed to diplomacy and then come out with this? If you want peace you need to talk to the bad guys anon, the last 20 years has forever established that the "we do not negotiate with terrorists" meme doesn't work in practice.
>It's not ridiculous to return stolen property
Crimea was only granted to Ukrainian SSR as a gift from the Russian SSR in the 50s. The region is majority russian speaking and even many pragmatic liberals and conservatives are accepting of its status as part of Russia now. Are you anarchist or something I feel like you're being needlessly childish here.
>And I won't believe any of your tough talk until I see some of your blood spilled, cause every tankie I've ever met is the biggest fucking suburbanite softie brainlet I've ever met. I know that's not necessarily true outside the west, but if a tankie can speak english fluently, they are always huge pussies talking shit.
The same is true for all leftists retard. In the west only a handful of leftist groups have taken up arms in the last 20 years and they've all been crushed. It is not the time for violent action yet, suicidal meme-y terrorist attacks are for chuds lol.

>>456243
I'm a "Russia shill" who's native .net. I know a few of the mods support Russia in the war too. There's also plenty of people on .org who hate Russia. Stop making it a site issue when it isn't is what I'm saying.
>>

 No.456250

File: 1661120245897.png (57.05 KB, 1200x1200, max.png)

>>456227
>Wow what an extremely convoluted way to say that glowies are based for killing people who you don't agree with.
When glowies please my ego, they are based.
>>

 No.456251

>>456244
>you cannot call yourself a Marxist. I'm sorry.
Stalinism =/= Marxism
>>

 No.456252

File: 1661121660976.png (141.56 KB, 790x596, 1660611708304496.png)

>>456212
I love this black and white thinking. "anyone who says x is y."

How fucking sadly dumb humanity is. Perhaps we truly are doomed. I don't even support NATO or Ukraine but fuck dugin. Like when did they left collectively go insane?
>>

 No.456253

>>456205
>Beginning in 2019, we would have dinner together at least once a month, and sometimes during those dinners, he would bring up (what I assumed at the time was) his academic interest in corporal punishment, especially spanking. As time went on, we became closer and closer friends, which led to him confiding in me in 2020 during the beginning of the COVID pandemic that his “academic” special interest was, in fact, a sexual one.
Oh holy kek
>>

 No.456254

File: 1661121942895-0.png (220.72 KB, 577x580, image-68.png)

File: 1661121942895-1.png (77.92 KB, 250x412, FarneseWhipsHerself.png)

>>456253
He really was into getting spanked. He's like that chick from berserk who is into submission for the holy see.
>>

 No.456255

>>456205
>Therefore, I ended up doing sex work so I could make enough to support our household and pay off my debts while still having enough time to canvass full-time for the JBVs. I distinctly remember telling Caleb that it seemed like sex work was my only way out of this delicate financial situation; his response was simply that he “respect[s] my decision.”
Caleb was a pimp?
>>

 No.456256

>>456252
It's always been this say. Followers of Stalin in foreign countries were calling people who disagreed with them fascists.
>>

 No.456257

>>456205
>In December 2021, Caleb asked me to replace his former dominatrix, Miss Lucy. I agreed to do so — for $250 per session
>he essentially paid me to reenact his childhood corporal punishment as a fatherly figure to discipline him.
>Another thing that Caleb mentioned to me at some point in 2018, was that he would ask women if they were ever spanked as a child, and liked to talk to women about their experiences and share his own childhood spanking memories. Caleb told me that he knows this is bad, but he would take what they shared with him and masturbate about them being spanked. NOT them being spanked as a child, but he would just masturbate to the whole idea of them expressing their feelings on being spanked and punished. I was really shocked and disgusted that he had told me this.
>Between February 2019 and April 2019, Caleb began mentioning the idea of a “social media coach.” Caleb started to increase how often he would bring up the “social media coach” idea. He wanted to find a woman who would text him throughout the week to check in on him and make sure to shame and admonish him if he wasn’t reaching his goals in growing his following online. Then, the social media coach would meet up with him and spank his rear end at the end of the week, which he would pay for. I kept once again trying to do deflecting measures, like I would tell him to check out an app called Seeking Arrangements, where he can create a profile and find someone to charter up this
What am I reading?
>>

 No.456258

>>456256
It's the same treatment someone might have got if you were in an irl group before the internet and went against the mantra, except now it's memes and the same name calling instead of getting kicked out.
>>

 No.456259

>>456212
Hello fellow leftists, I was wondering if critical support for National Socialism in 2022 is actually anti-imperialist considering current material conditions?
>>

 No.456260

>>456212
>Under current material conditions russian nationalism is anti-imperialism
kek. The entire imperialism and anti-imperialism dynamic is shit, it's like a leftover from people rooting for the underdog.
>>

 No.456261

Under current material conditions german nationalism is anti-imperialism. heil hitler.
>>

 No.456264

>>456259
Adding the triple parentheses around "leftists" would really add to the satire value of /pol/-brained tankies. As in:
>Hello fellow (((leftists))), I was wondering if….
>>

 No.456265

File: 1661127627850.jpg (92.83 KB, 702x1024, 1660482390813124.jpg)

>>456260
Pretty much. This is why people were simping for lybia in 2008-2015
I mean, fuck the US for bombing lybia but also fuck Gadafi. I don't understand why people are so brain dead they think they have to be totally one or the other when it comes to politics. That's not even dialectical it's just dogmatic.
>>

 No.456266

File: 1661132219737.png (45.17 KB, 1827x215, Boom.png)

The fate of all tankies.
>>

 No.456267

>>456266
lmao link to thread?
>>

 No.456269

>>456266
>>456268
Really telling of the tankies at ogre that they insist on jannies to not only ban posters for anti-Russian imperialist wrong-think, but also delete their posts entirely. Especially when they are effortposts with clear evidence and reasoning that are too difficult to counter and provoke maximum Z-fag seethe. Almost like they are terrified of any anons reading and agreeing with the posts, thus cracking their forced pro-Z/Putin/Russian imperialist artificial board consensus. Pure powertripping on ogre
>>

 No.456270

LeftyChad the free speech board
>>

 No.456271

>>456269
>Almost like they are terrified of any anons reading and agreeing with the posts, thus cracking their forced pro-Z/Putin/Russian imperialist artificial board consensus
That's like any other radical group control is always a goal.
>>

 No.456272

File: 1661158561137.jpg (87.92 KB, 820x523, 1659021149767525.jpg)

>>456271
This is kind of even true of anarchists because anarchists are nutcases who use social shaming as a means of control and canceling their opposition. Though I disagree to an extent because Communists and Marxists are pretty radical positions too.
>>

 No.456273

File: 1661167500596.png (560.02 KB, 750x658, 1660881700602-0.png)

>>456219
>especially when they replace Russia as the EU's primary oil supplier.
Ukraine is 51st in proven oil reserves in the world. I already schooled you on this, why can't you learn?
>the Russia Federation has some of the highest wealth inequality,
>pic related
>>456203
are you actually proud of cheering for the CIA? this place is indistinguishable from reddit now.
>>

 No.456274

>>456265
>Men make their own history, but they do not make it as they please; they do not make it under self-selected circumstances, but under circumstances existing already, given and transmitted from the past.
Read Marx, lib.

Z
>>

 No.456276

>>456269
>Especially when they are effortposts with clear evidence and reasoning that are too difficult to counter and provoke maximum Z-fag seethe.
>clear reasoning
LOL
Because if people wanted to read the latest CIA press releases they could go to r/ukraine and r/worldnews. It's nice to have a place where the discourse isn't controlled by glowies. You seem to want an anti-Russian, pro-NATO echo chamber in which case you can go LITERALLY ANY WEBSITE on the western Internet. And even that isn't enough for you, it's total thought domination or nothing.
>>

 No.456277

File: 1661169148902.jpg (33.54 KB, 1200x675, maxresdefault.jpg)

>>456274
What does this have to do with literally anything?
>>

 No.456278

>>456277
The poster was talking about Gaddafi, saying he doesn't support NATO or Gaddafi. In the case of Libya the two options were Gaddafi or the NATO-backed rebels, there was no third, pure socialist option. Saying you won't oppose NATO until there is some perfect movement that ticks all your boxes means that you will never oppose NATO.

Marx's quote I posted means that we do not get to choose in which conditions we do our work, we have to look at material reality, accept it and work with it. This is pretty simple stuff, I don't know why I have to explain this to you.
>>

 No.456279

File: 1661169750160.jpg (11.26 KB, 227x222, 165931819655.jpg)

>>456276
>isn't controlled by glowies
>ogre literally harvests user data and spies on their own users.


This isn't an echochamber it's a place to discuss political events not jerk yourself off. That's why it's better than your circle jerk. The jannies here aren't going to coddle you. You have to show your point of view actually makes sense. Cope, you are like a child who needs the protection of its mother.

>>456273
Why support Russia though? Even if you don't support NATO and ukraine. I don't. You zoomers aren't old enough to remember the anti-war movement, but, I am.
>>

 No.456280

File: 1661169875821.jpg (229.32 KB, 627x720, 1658747651606848.jpg)

>>456278
So your conclusion was too…..support a literal oligarch and his fascist buddies?
>>

 No.456281

>>456279
>Why support Russia though?
Who is supporting Russia? Your little lib brain sees opposition to NATO as support of the Other. In that case, I "support" Cuba, DPRK, China, and every other non-white country that opposes NATO. If I think Taliban are better than US-occupied government does that mean I support fundamentalist Islam?
>You zoomers aren't old enough to remember the anti-war movement, but, I am.
I participated in the anti-war protests in 2001, you smug liberal bitch.
>>

 No.456282

>>456280
Libya
>richest and most developed country in Africa
>free education in any university on the planet
>cheap gas
>no foreign debt
>huge oil and gold reserves
>every newly married couple got a free apartment
You white people just can't handle black people not suffering and actually thriving. You cheer on the death of Gaddafi, destruction of Libya because he was "le evil oligarch" but fail to mention that what came after the most prosperous country in Africa was destroyed are open slave markets and concentration camps for African migrants.

Wow, I am glad Gaddafi is gone so that I am finally able to purchase human beings. That motherfucking oligarch fascist was trampling on my rights!
>>

 No.456283

>>456282
good post but
>white people
>black people
i detect an americanoid
>>

 No.456284

>>456283
>americanoid
Nope, I'm just listening. The media and liberals are justifying better treatment of Ukrainian refugees than MENA refugees because Ukrainians are white, look like us, etc.

This is why NATO and US are allowed to invade countries all over Middle East and Africa, shit on their sovereignty, drone strike with impunity, but as soon as the same happens to a European country it is the worst thing that has every happened in history.

I'm not married to the idea that there's a racial aspect to it, but I honestly can't seem to rule it out as a large aspect of it and motivating factor. If you have a better explanation or a counter argument, I'd love to hear it.
>>

 No.456287

File: 1661181708334.png (1.3 MB, 1440x1981, Hairstyle.png)

>>456273
>Ukraine is 51st in proven oil reserves in the world. I already schooled you on this, why can't you learn?
No you didn't, I proved you wrong. You're just spreading disinfo because you don't realize that quote from Goebbles is missing it's second half.
>Excluding Russia’s gas reserves in Asia, Ukraine today holds the second biggest known gas reserves in Europe. As of late 2019, known Ukrainian reserves amounted to 1.09 trillion cubic meters of natural gas, second only to Norway’s known resources of 1.53 trillion cubic meters. Yet, these enormous reserves of energy remain largely untapped. Today, Ukraine has a low annual reserve usage rate of about 2 percent. Moreover, more active exploration may yield previously undiscovered gas fields, which would further increase the overall volume of Ukraine’s deposits.
https://hir.harvard.edu/ukraine-energy-reserves/
And of course once I looked up what a "proven oil reserve" and it is a very flexible term that you used to lie about Ukraine's oil.
>Proven reserves are the amount of oil or natural resources contained under a piece of land with a 90% or greater probability of profitable extraction.
Also known as P90 reserves,
>Proven reserves are dynamic; they can increase or decrease based on a variety of factors, including regulations and available technology.
https://www.investopedia.com/terms/p/proven-reserves.asp
So Ukraine lacks "proven oil reserves" because Russia hasn't given them the opportunity to explore them or bring in foreign investment to buy the tech to prove them. But if you read the Harvard article there's every indication that this oil is very extractable and that if it is, their reserves are second and only to Russia's.
>>

 No.456288

>>456281
>Who is supporting Russia?
You are, you parrot all of Russia's talking points, cope endlessly about how this isn't a shit show for them. And accuse anyone who supports Ukraine defending themselves as glowies, libs or NATO personnel.
You ztards are parodies of yourselves at this point.
>>

 No.456289

>>456287
>So Ukraine lacks "proven oil reserves" because Russia hasn't given them the opportunity to explore them or bring in foreign investment to buy the tech to prove them.
You said they discovered them in 2014.
>Russia hasn't given them the opportunity.
Umm sweetie, the Putin puppet Yanukovych was ousted in a glorious people's revolution in 2014. They had 8 years to buy/import the technology to extract the oil. What were they doing for those 8 years? Oh that's right, they were busy ethnically cleansing Russians from Donbass.

If Ukraine's oil reserves are actually viable, don't you think the US would be over there with their oil companies since they had a friendly administration in power in Ukraine?
>we extract oil from the bottom of the sea
>we extract oil in the desert
>we extract oil from sand
<but they couldn't extract oil from Ukraine
what does that tell you?
>>

 No.456291

File: 1661184106277.jpg (1.93 MB, 1920x2400, blacklives.jpg)

>>456289
>You said they discovered them in 2014.
Yes OIL was discovered, you obviously didn't read my post. Simply discovering oil doesn't meet the "prove oil reserves" criteria
BECAUSE PROVEN OIL RESERVES IS NOT A SCIENTIFIC TERM, IT IS AN INVESTMENT ONE
It just means oil that is for sure going to make money once extracted. It does not mean that Ukraine's oil reserves don't exist or are unextractable, and it fact give every indication that they could be developed into "proven" reserves.
>They had 8 years to buy/import the technology to extract the oil.
>They had 8 years to buy/import the technology to extract the oil.
What is Crimea, what is Dombass
>they were busy ethnically cleansing Russians from Donbass.
Genocides are hard to cover up, surely you have proof of this, right?
>don't you think the US would be over there with their oil companies since they had a friendly administration in power in Ukraine?
No, Ukrainian oil reserves are strategically important to the EU and Russia, not the US. The US already has itself, Saudi Arabia, Kurdish oil and a huge portfolio of other oil reserves it can tap.
>what does that tell you?
Russia kept Ukraine out of the EU to prevent it from developing it's oil reserves.
>>

 No.456292

>>456291
>Russia kept Ukraine out of the EU to prevent it from developing it's oil reserves.
Putin puppet Yanukovych was ousted in 2014. How did Russia control Ukraine once their guy was out of power? Maybe that was wizard Dugin also!
>Genocides are hard to cover up, surely you have proof of this, right?
Banning a language and displacing the population is considered ethnic cleansing, which is a form of genocide. Hey, don't look at me, libs made that definition so they could call the Yugo wars genocide. It's not my fault that it's an inconvenient definition now that one of your guys is doing it.
>It does not mean that Ukraine's oil reserves don't exist or are unextractable, and it fact give every indication that they could be developed into "proven" reserves.
Eight years. They had eight years and they did fuck all with those reserves. Maybe Ukrainians just like receiving money from EU, but not working for it. In which case Ukraine is anti-work gang, so based.
>>

 No.456293

>>456291
>Genocides are hard to cover up, surely you have proof of this, right?
https://www.rt.com/russia/561314-kill-russians-ukraine-ambassador/
>Ukraine is doing its best to “kill as many Russians” as possible, the nation’s ambassador to Kazakhstan, Pyotr Vrublevsky, told local media outlets on Monday.

>Speaking to a local blogger, Vrublevsky was asked to comment on the ongoing Ukraine conflict. “What can I say … We are trying to kill as many [Russians] as possible. The more Russians we kill now, the fewer our children will have to. That’s it,” he said.
>inb4 he's a nobody
He's an ambassador, hand-picked by Zelensky. Dugin is a university professor who wrote a book. Just preemptively destroying your argument. 😎
>>

 No.456294

>>456292
>Banning a language
They didn't ban the language, they just dropped it as their offical language.
>and displacing the population is considered ethnic cleansing,
They got displaced because of a civil war Russia instigated.
>>

 No.456295

>>456292
>Eight years. They had eight years
Yes, and what's been going on in the last 8 years ztard?
The booj rightfully worried about losing their investment to a Russian invasion that no one believed Ukraine could repel as much as they have.
>>

 No.456297

File: 1661187915303.jpg (100.2 KB, 750x920, 1660544720119705.jpg)

>>456281
Imagine participating in anti-war protests in 2001 which were the largest global protests ever seen on earth and still sitting here jerking off over the Russian army and a thug like Putin cause "muh imperialis."

Was the concept of imperialism a mistake? I mean really imperialism is just a higher abstract function of capitalism no? Why not just see it as that? It's because of the way its presented as its own thing that retards like this believe parroting Kremlin talking points is a good idea.
>>

 No.456298

>>456295
>they were able to extract oil from warzones in Syria, Yemen and Iraq
>a localised conflict in the very east of Ukraine prevented them from extracting oil
You're excuses are getting weaker. The simpler explanation is that Ukraine is a corrupt, failed state where oligarchs are trying to make as much money before moving their capital to the West. Oligarchs aren't interested in building anything, they just want the easy gibs.
>>

 No.456299

File: 1661188079753.gif (223.47 KB, 191x411, 16597934567.gif)

>>456282
>Muh black people

Go back to reddit fag.

Just because a country does well doesn't magically dissolve the crimes of the people who run them. Are you seriously that stupid? You realize this exact logic would absolve the nazis of their crimes correct? Are you really this dumb

b..b…b….bb….they did good things!

Ok and?

What a retard.

You're also racist for deploying black people as some sort of political tool to win an argument.
>>

 No.456300

>>456284
No America can invade these countries because it is the most power imperialist power on earth and is heavily driven by profit motives. What do you retards think? That when you parrot Russian propoganda the American Government magically becomes powerless? Like some kind of dragon ball Z fight or something? The US was going to intervene in these countries no matter what. That doesn't mean you should post copium and propoganda defending the retarded shit they do. You're a literal religious zealot. I 100% guarantee you would have been following Maupin spanking his booty for the CPI if you had the chance.
>>

 No.456301

>>456298
>Hostile foreign power takes 3 bites out of your territory in less than a decade then invades.
>T-t-t-t-that's not an excuse as to why they didn't develop their massive oil reserves.
I guess it's just a co-winky-dink Russia started applying sanctions on Ukraine to keep them out of the EU right around the time they discovered enough oil to put Russia out of business.
>>

 No.456302

File: 1661189683786.jpg (98.34 KB, 1680x1050, 1659973312176216.jpg)

>>456297
Lenin was a brainlet and his followers even more so. His "thoery" isn't a theory at all and doesn't add anything to Marx's theory.
For something to be a theory what you theorize has to be present all the time.
There are no "stages" to Marx's theory, where there is capitalism Marx's critique applies. There's no arbitrary hoop capitalism must jump through before "Das Capital" becomes true.
Not so with Lenin, which is why you get all these inane arguments on "what is REAL imperalism".
This belief that Lenin's writings are theory on par with Marx's are also why Marxist-Leninist regimes fail. Since they believe their "theory" is correct and they're authoritarian, when things go wrong they do not attempt in earnest to change. Believing that if they only push a little further, they'll inevitable break through the roadblock their experiencing.
This leads to the hubris that Soviet style economies are infamous for (shortages, woefully abysmal quality compared to western counterparts, hostile to baffling design and cult like belief that they're better than products produced by capitalist pigs despite all the proof to the contrary.
Lenin had a good analysis of the politics of his own time, but that analysis become less and less relevant as time passes, and his followers become more hysterical and paranoid to reconcile it.
>>

 No.456309

File: 1661201678421.jpg (135.96 KB, 1200x971, rs-181096-515105723.jpg)


>According to a Russian journalist who remains in touch with Mikhail Gorbachev, the former Soviet president is unhappy with the current state of affairs in Ukraine and feels his legacy is being undone by Russian President Vladimir Putin’s government.
>Currently aged 91 and in poor health – he’s suffering from long-term kidney issues and has been placed on dialysis – Gorbachev has not publicly commented on Russia’s “special military operation” in Ukraine.
>However, in an interview with Russian Forbes, journalist Alexei Venediktov revealed that the former Soviet president is “upset” over how things have turned out.

>“Gorbachev’s reforms – political, not economic – were all destroyed,” Venediktov said. “Nilch, zero, ashes.”
>Gorbachev also established a good relationship with Western powers, which resulted in a decrease in the amount of on-the-ground NATO personnel in Europe by the time he left office.
“When Gorbachev was leaving, there were 4,000 NATO Response Forces in Europe – four thousand,” said Venediktov. “Now, NATO has announced 300,000 people by the end of the year, so today there are 40,000 – and will be 300,000.”

>“I can tell you that [Gorbachev] is upset,” Denediktov concluded. “Of course, he understands that […] this was his life’s work. Freedoms were brought by Gorbachev.
>Everyone forgot who gave freedom to the Russian Orthodox Church. Who was it? Mikhail Sergeyevich Gorbachev. The freedom of press, the first media law, who brought it? Mikhail Sergeyevich Gorbachev. Private property? Mikhail Sergeyevich Gorbachev.

>“So what would [Gorbachev] be able to say now?”
>>

 No.456311

>>456302
Lenin made the right decisions at the time but he shouldn't be looked up too just because he was the "successful" one.
>>

 No.456312

>>456282
>You cheer on the death of Gaddafi, destruction of Libya because he was "le evil oligarch"
I'm indifferent to it I don't cheer or cry over it.
>>

 No.456314

File: 1661202685531.png (652.25 KB, 675x636, 1661196355426384.png)

*Copied from 4chan's /k/

Holy fucking shit vatniks are the most inept retards in the history of mankind. This is what you get for running ops in a country in which 100% of the population hates you. FSB retards admitted to Albanian prosecutor that they're Russian spies.

NATO ARTICLE 5 INCOMING???

Google translation:

Exclusive/ The arrested Russians are revealed! They admit that they worked for the Russian secret services

22/08/2022 19:43


One of the Russians arrested in Gramsh has admitted that he was ordered to take photos in several places in Albania.

According to Top Channel sources, the Russian citizen confessed that he was contacted by Russian agents to take photos of objects of special importance such as military plants, ports and water supply in our country, but says that he has no more information.

Mikhail Zorin has stated that with the agents of the country not friendly with Albania, he only dealt with Telegraf, but he does not know the Russian investigators by name. He has shown that with the drone that was found in the bag, he filmed over Bovilla lake and also filmed in the port of Durrës.

On Wednesday or Thursday, the three arrested who were caught on Saturday in Gramsh will appear before the court. They are being investigated on charges of espionage and are being held at the police headquarters of Elbasan, where they have been questioned by prosecutors. In the meantime, the court has mainly appointed lawyers, who have met with their clients today.

https://albaniandailynews.com/news/russian-admits-spying-albanian-objects-of-special-importance
>>

 No.456316

>>456309
This is his fucking fault lmao. He's the one who dissolved the Soviet union through a dubious and poorly worded ballot measure. At any rate, I don't think anyone here supports NATO even though CPI retards want to paint the opposition that way.
>>

 No.456317

>>456314
The US shouldn't be coopting nations on the border of Russia by incorporating then into NATO either fag.
>>

 No.456318

>>456297
>Was the concept of imperialism a mistake?
No Lenin was very correct on most accounts
I would criticize Lenin for calling imperialism the "highest stage" because looking at the imperial core, it looks more like a regression than something higher. At the moment capitalist countries become imperialist they are at their peak, and during the imperial stage these societies go into decline.

I would've called it "imperialism the rotten stage of capitalism"

>I mean really imperialism is just a higher abstract function of capitalism no?
Not really, imperialism is a stage of capitalism, and it has turned into a global system.
Not all capitalist countries will become imperialist, because they lack the geographic advantage, size, or simply because the capitalist mode of production will have ended before they grow finance capital that is strong enough to subjugate an economy for it's imperial ambitions. Your analysis is neglecting material conditions.


>>456302
>Lenin was a brainlet
Lenin was brilliant not only as a revolutionary and statesman, but also as a theoretician, that has produced a lot of theory that stood the test of time. (obviously not everything Lenin said turned out to be true)

>This belief that Lenin's writings are theory on par with Marx's are also why Marxist-Leninist regimes fail. Since they believe their "theory" is correct and they're authoritarian
<regime
you mean government
<authoritarian
We could create a society as close to a utopia as it's humanly possible, think about star trek or the Orville tv-shows as aspirational examples, but then some neo-liberal goon would still call that authoritarian because it lacked the "freedom" to brutally exploit people. It's a meaningless word.
>>

 No.456320

>>456318
>We could create a society as close to a utopia as it's humanly possible,
Soviet states don't even have as much freedom as booj capitalist states do. You all wig out even now online under any substantial criticism, and the amount of abuses of power in Soviet govs is legion. Your vanguard party is completely unaccountable once in power and because you eschew democracy, and no getting to vote on which party flunkie gets to be line manager doesn't count.
For all your though talk tankies still have never reconciled how an economy under their complete control got handed over to the booj other than pathetic idealist copes like revisionism.
>>

 No.456321

>>456320
>Your vanguard party is completely unaccountable once in power because you eschew democracy
>>

 No.456322

>>456317
Cope, Russia invaded over Ukraine's oil reserves.
>>

 No.456323

File: 1661208462267.png (701.04 KB, 512x959, 1661207318276674.png)

>>

 No.456324

>>456322
But the US would benefit from this arrangement too no?
>>

 No.456325

>>456323
lol
>>

 No.456326

File: 1661208922387-0.jpg (59.96 KB, 490x530, 1661208110380381.jpg)

File: 1661208922387-1.jpg (91.19 KB, 872x728, 1661208114338665.jpg)

>>

 No.456328

File: 1661209392621.png (792.47 KB, 933x795, 1661208812426225.png)

>>

 No.456330

File: 1661210608372.webm (2.23 MB, 480x848, 1661208794957460.webm)

Original vid
>>

 No.456332

>>456330
What the hell does the 112 mean?
>>

 No.456333

>>456332
Russian version of 911 emergency services
>>

 No.456334

>>456326
>anakiddie spreading bullshit news articles about US geopolitical enemies
You know the reason why everyone thinks you guys are feds is because no same person would do this for free.
>>

 No.456335

>>456334
>Nooooo how can you think my heckin good Russiarinos are raping people, you must be a fed ;_;
>>

 No.456336

>>456335
The source for that article is some glowie ukrainian news site. It's clearly propaganda retard. About as true as Gadaffi's african rape gangs we all heard about 11 years ago.

If you knew anything about this war you'd know the last thing the Russians would want to do is mistreat the population of Kherson. It's the only major city they have captured, thus it is in their interest to set a good example of what life under Russian rule would look like to discourage ukrainian resistance.
>>

 No.456337

File: 1661222207884.jpeg (168.55 KB, 1024x544, glowie.jpeg)

>>456336 (me)
So just to prove a point to myself, I looked into the supporters of that Ukrainian news website and hooooollllly shieeett…

The website itself (Rubryka) is entirely funded by the Swedish government and an org called "internews". Now some of the donors for internews include:
>Ford Foundation
>Omidyar Network (ran by founder of eBay)
>Rockefeller Brothers Fund
>Rockefeller Family & Associates
>Rockefeller Foundation
>Open Society Foundations (Soros)
>Facebook
>Google
>Sky News (Murdoch)
>BBC media action
>Freedom House (unapologetically CIA)
>Johns Hopkins University
>National Democratic Institute
>National Endowment for Democracy (kekekekekek)
>The Asia Foundation (based in San Francisco)
>Vodafone Americas Foundation
And these are just the ones that sounded sus or I had already heard of, there's about 100 more donors who are probably just as bad: https://internews.org/about/current-donors/

Do anarkiddies seriously think they are fighting capitalism when these people are their allies?
>>

 No.456338

File: 1661227274491.jpg (1.65 MB, 2610x1796, tankies.jpg)

>>456336
>>456337
>Glowie
>Glowie
>Glowie
This is literally the only thing ztards can say when faced with these allegations.
These types of allegations have been pouring in and are unfortunately normal large military force. Even the US military has issues with this and they are 1000x times more disciplined than the Russian military which rape their own soldiers more than any military on earth.
https://www.latimes.com/world-nation/story/2022-08-21/russias-most-hidden-crime-in-ukraine-war-rape
There not "Marxist" media so yeah, all the reports are going to come from mostly Western sources, they ain't going to come from RT and they sure as fuck aren't going to come from Tankie sources.
And quit calling me an anarchikiddie, I posted that flag my mistake ya little wannbe tinpot dictator.
Maybe actually produce something to refute it, or at least show how it couldn't be correct.
The Russian's just posted a vid of them cutting the balls off a Ukrainian solider, have long called Ukrainians "Holohos" and referred to Ukraine as an illegitimate sovereign state that belongs to Russia.
Here's more reports about Russian rapes but I'm sure you'll handwave this as glowie propaganda too.
https://web.archive.org/web/20220331044253/https://www.latimes.com/politics/story/2022-03-30/many-denounce-war-crimes-in-ukraine-but-justice-is-slow-why-this-time-might-be-different
>>

 No.456339

>>456337
>I called you a glowie, so I don't have to refute shit.
The tankie intellect is truly staggering.
>>

 No.456340

It wasn’t a bombing. It was a special relocation of explosives operation.
>>

 No.456341

File: 1661229613905.jpg (28.62 KB, 500x281, 1654295122439.jpg)

>>456337
The US government also gives funding to the development of the Tor network they created in the 70s throw GH the US Navy and yet some how that does not inherently make the Tor network compromised by the federal government. If this is true then we should believe everything the Chinese government says simply because they say it. Either something is true or it is not and not liking the source doesn't make it wrong lol. Just because a source has bias doesn't make it inherently wrong. Do you lack any critical thinking skills what so ever?
>>

 No.456342

File: 1661230177955.jpg (156.22 KB, 685x1280, 20220428_180327.jpg)

>>456338
Anon do you not under how propaganda works? Don't trust what the Russians say about NATO and don't trust what the Americans say about Russia, in the absence of hard evidence.
I presented more than enough proof that the news source provided is heavily compromised by porkie. When looking for reliable and impartial news sources covering eastern Europe, I think we can all agree that ones openly sponsored by the Pentagon, Soros and Murdoch rank very low in terms of reliability.
>The Russian's just posted a vid of them cutting the balls off a Ukrainian solider, have long called Ukrainians "Holohos" and referred to Ukraine as an illegitimate sovereign state that belongs to Russia.
I have seen videos of Ukrainians brutalising russian soldiers too, and Ukrainians call the Russians 'orcs' all the time on western television. There was a video going round of a Ukrainian guy eating dead russian soldiers. War is hell

>>456339
Read the article yourself. They offer no proof for these allegations other than "local sources". I can't refute shit if there's nothing to disprove in the first place.
https://rubryka.com/en/2022/03/03/herson-divchat-prosyat-zalyshatysya-vdoma-i-ne-vyhodyty-na-vulytsi-ye-fakty-nasyllya/amp/
>>

 No.456343

>>456342
I never really believe any screenshot of any news article that is posted on an imageboards lol.
>>

 No.456344

File: 1661231432310.jpg (82.77 KB, 465x604, 20220317_232310.jpg)

>>456341
>Just because a source has bias doesn't make it inherently wrong.
There's a difference between by bias and a source being created with the specific purpose of spreading propaganda and conducting psyops. Look at that list of donors man, your "source" is literally a mouthpiece for the anglo and and european elite.

>>456343
Absolutely. You go on /pol/ and they're posting screenshots of headlines from PJW's blog and davidduke.com and the chinlets take it as fact.
>>

 No.456345

>>456344
Yeah I didn't realize you were talking about the screen cap. I was wrong my bad.
>>

 No.456347

File: 1661237626915.jpg (493.45 KB, 1080x726, obama.jpg)

>>456342
>Read the article yourself. They offer no proof for these allegations other than "local sources". I can't refute shit if there's nothing to disprove in the first place.
If you wanna call the report weak that's fine. But you tankies like to pretend these reports live in a vacuum.
I already posted the LA Times article which contains a lot more allegations, and the fact that the Russian army has a problem with rape within it's own ranks, and the sexual assault allegations during the Chechen War, which the West supported btw.
So you can take your fainted indignation and GTFO of here.
>>

 No.456349

>>456344
>There's a difference between by bias and a source being created with the specific purpose of spreading propaganda and conducting psyops.
Well first off, plenty of true reporting comes out of places supported by these foundations, PBS has a lot of these same donors.
Also propaganda isn't always about lying, it's also about telling the truth as well.
The fact is the west doesn't need to lie about Russian war crimes, that literally servers no purpose when it's so clear they're happening, all lying would do is give Russia an easy out and ability to say all the allegations were lies because they can prove one was which is exactly what happened in Syria and the gas attacks.
If anything it can be argued that the fact that this report is coming from a western source makes it MORE likely it's true since they want as much embarrassing information as possible to be spread about the invasion.
>>

 No.456351

>>456342
The problem with you tankies isn't that your wrong to point out potential bias, it's that alllllllllllll your arguments are logically fallacious like this.
You'll fedjacket someone at the drop of a hat, but demand that Russia and your own tattered reputations be ignored.
You'll scream bias and propaganda based on nothing but guilt by association just as you have now.
You'll argue as loud and fast as possible to make your own very biased arguments appear to be coming from the center.
And you'll change the subject to every single fucking crime real or imagined done by the west and demand they be reconciled before any discussion about Russian wrong doing can begin.
The sad part is you really think all these rhetorical tricks work, that you're dazzling your opponents into submission. When in reality all these hackneyed outbursts are about as convincing as a toddler smeared with chocolate denying they ate all the cookies.
>>

 No.456372

File: 1661293394985-0.png (717.89 KB, 1080x1410, ClipboardImage.png)

File: 1661293394985-1.png (608.4 KB, 1080x885, ClipboardImage.png)

Least unhinged tankie
>>

 No.456380

>>456372
That's always been normal for tankies but they never say it out loud like this retard.
>>

 No.456381

>>456372
Kek
>>

 No.456383

>>456380
Really?! 0_o
Wait this guy wasn't shit posting.
>>

 No.456392

File: 1661323138460.jpg (323.62 KB, 792x422, Reddit dugin.jpg)

reddit weighs in on the Dugin assassination…
>>

 No.456393

>>456392
This is basically how Russians talk about Ukrainians.
>>

 No.456395

>>456392
I mean, kind of not wrong. Alexander Dugin should have died in that blast too, fascist pidorashka.

I don't get how all of these hardcore commie faggots are supporting a nigh-fascist move to destroy a sovereign nation. They want NATO not to exist for the pure purpose of war against their enemies and indoctrination.

Authoritarianism needs to be crushed.
>>

 No.456396

>>456393
>show evidence liberals are doing something
<umm sweaty, that's actually the other side
>liberal arguments
I can't wait for the screeching, the cope, the tears, the seething once Russia achieves its objectives.
>>

 No.456397

>>456396
For what purpose do you want to see this? Why are you not fighting with your Wagner Nazi Brothers on the front lines?
>>

 No.456398

File: 1661335337305-0.jpg (1.47 MB, 1393x2160, 1660616025562.jpg)

File: 1661335337305-1.jpg (6.34 MB, 4500x3263, 1659631518527-0.jpg)

File: 1661335337305-2.png (768.1 KB, 1200x1537, 1660621052817-0.png)

File: 1661335337305-3.png (1.28 MB, 1261x1216, 1660617715237.png)

File: 1661335337305-4.jpg (59.6 KB, 720x671, 1652208120450-3.jpg)

>>456397
Because you liberals are smug about everything, your ideology is the dominant one so you feel like you just need to appeal to the status quo. You're used to repeating imperialist propaganda and it coming true. Well this time it is not coming true. I can't wait to see your world come crashing down, or you'll just deny reality and go full schizo. In any case, it'll be funny.
>MUH WAGNERRRR
Azov
>muh Wagner
Pravy Sektor
>muh Wagner
Svoboda
>muh Wagner
C14
>muh Wagner
OUN
>muh Wagner
UPA
>muh Wagner
…
>>

 No.456399

>>456398
>you liberals

You're just like a rightoid calling everyone a jew or a uyghur. You don't know who I am.

None of those headlines changes the reality that Neo-Nazis exist in both countries, as well as the LPR and DNR having their own units who have actively committed atrocities in the name of Russian panslavism since 2014.

It is notable to point out how close Wagner is to Putin himself, and them being an important tool in his Imperialist ventures. Speaking of imperialist ventures, Ukraine is one such based off ethnonationalist rhetoric. I bet you ignore it whenever you see or hear Russians use the phrase hohol.

Shut the fuck up.
>>

 No.456400

>>456399
You called me a Nazi, you dumb fucking lib. You're closer to liberals than I am to Nazis, cope bitch.
>Neo-Nazis exist in both countries
wow, so smart. except in Ukraine they're ruling the country and in Russia they end up in prison.
>totally the same
>It is notable to point out how close Wagner is to Putin himself,
just like Dugin is his brain, right?

You are using all the liberal talking points, and now you're mad you get called a liberal. Maybe you should take a look at yourself, LIBERAL.
>>

 No.456401

File: 1661342798636-0.mp4 (1.33 MB, 720x976, 1651069661095.mp4)

File: 1661342798636-1.jpg (72.75 KB, 587x604, 1658008421345-1.jpg)

File: 1661342798636-2.jpg (131.47 KB, 940x942, 1658008421345-0.jpg)

File: 1661342798636-3.jpg (956.61 KB, 1205x1418, 1657177567511.jpg)

File: 1661342798636-4.mp4 (5.42 MB, 1280x720, 1651962775637.mp4)

>>456399
Even the Ukrops are laughing at you.
>Ukrainian Nazis: We are nazis.
<You: Noooo, you are based freedom fighters fighting Nazis.
>Ukrainian Nazis: No, really, we are actual Nazis. We're proud of it.
<You: Noo, Russia is more Nazi, Wagner! Putler! Reeeeeeee
>>

 No.456402

>>456401
oops, 4th pic is Polish Nazi girls, my bad. Hard to keep track of ALL THESE FUCKING NAZIS.
>>

 No.456403

>>456400
OK if Nazis in Russia are all in prison, why was Rusich used to spearhead combat for the seperatists in 2014 and still operating in combat to this day? Why are blatant Nazis who are part of a multimillion dollar mercenary group not in jail? Can you answer that?
>>

 No.456404

>>456403
>Can you answer that?
Can you provide any proof of your claims? This is the nth time you have ignored everything I've posted and changed the subject. I post pictures, videos, all kind of shit, but you just make a claim and I'm supposed to argue against it?

Show evidence or accept your BTFO status.
>>

 No.456405

File: 1661344498122-0.jpg (216.18 KB, 1036x648, 1655401330946.jpg)

File: 1661344498122-1.png (670.62 KB, 1008x568, 1654873512237-0.png)

File: 1661344498122-2.jpg (94.77 KB, 720x405, 1654489724708.jpg)

File: 1661344498122-3.png (364.21 KB, 956x956, FSyUq-3aIAAAb_C.png)

File: 1661344498122-4.jpg (61.44 KB, 1024x647, 1651496093430-1.jpg)

>>456403
Also, the only "proof" you have that Wagner are Nazis is that ONE photo of a Wagner mercenary with SS tattoos and the fact that "Wagner was Hitler's favourite composer".

This false equivalence you're trying to push doesn't hold water. It is a FACT there's way more Nazis in Ukraine and they hold ACTUAL POWER. Cope and seethe.
>>

 No.456406

File: 1661344743523-0.jpg (225.51 KB, 1260x840, downloadfile(1).jpg)

File: 1661344743523-1.jpg (3.63 MB, 3033x2022, 1657978642441.jpg)

File: 1661344743523-2.jpg (129 KB, 1280x852, 1656880224597.jpg)

File: 1661344743523-3.jpg (117.46 KB, 873x1280, 1650689339916.jpg)

File: 1661344743523-4.jpg (759.1 KB, 1738x2110, 1650520547809-0.jpg)

>>456403
Yes, I do support the side fighting under the Soviet red banner of victory rather than the side fighting under a swastika. For me, it wasn't a tough choice. Maybe ask yourself why are you defending actual Nazis? Like wtf bro?
>>

 No.456407

File: 1661346382119-0.jpg (83.76 KB, 800x420, NINTCHDBPICT000724531852.jpg)

File: 1661346382119-1.jpg (283.16 KB, 1280x1097, IMG_20220715_170338_636.jpg)

>>456405
>>456406
You're an actual retard, if you got that far trying to decode Wagner. Then push further, you'll find Rusich too. That ONE guy is one of the co-founders of Wagner, and Rusich is affiliated. They're all Nazis.

I'm aware Nazis exist in Ukraine also lmao, you don't have to tell me that for the nth time. Here's some pictures for you of Russian Nazis since you like to send nothing but images. The first pic is Rusich.

You are fetishizing just Nazis in Ukraine, and trusting an Oligarch. There's Nazis everywhere you idiot. Do you also collect gore of dead hohols? You weirdo.
>>

 No.456408

>>456407
Excuse me, both pics ar Rusich.
>>

 No.456410

File: 1661348446794.jpg (128.48 KB, 1284x1520, 8fnnf4zy3ht81.jpg)

>>456406
>>456405
OH and here's a PICTURE of Putin having some special time with his little Nazi buddies.

You're just an authoritarian bootlicker supporting Putin's imperialist narrative. If it was just about denazifying Ukraine there would be no drive to annex Southern Ukraine.

Authoritarian retards like you should be shot along with fascists so we can skip the middle man and have an anarcho society.

Now answer my question, why are Wagner and Rusich not in jail?
>>

 No.456411

>>456410
Well they would have to be shot in the revolution they will shoot at us first.
>>

 No.456412

File: 1661350361862-0.jpg (166.62 KB, 1190x866, 1652574467675-3.jpg)

File: 1661350361862-1.png (1.39 MB, 960x960, 1652574467675-0.png)

File: 1661350361862-2.jpg (88.44 KB, 1046x788, 1652595414132-1.jpg)

File: 1661350361862-3.png (309.66 KB, 589x580, 1652048822299.png)

File: 1661350361862-4.jpg (283.03 KB, 926x826, 1650826398267-1.jpg)

>>456410
I already mentioned that guy before you, because that is ALL you libs have. >>456405
>that ONE photo of a Wagner mercenary with SS tattoos
Rusich has a kolovrat, even the fucking ADL (anti-defamation league) doesn't list the Kolovrat as an explicitly neo-nazi symbol, but says context is important. Fucking Mossad and zionists have more nuance than you. LMAO.

But you know what? I accept Rusich and Wagner are neo-nazi. Hear that? THEY ARE FUCKING NAZIS. Two groups.

Now compare it to Ukriane, how many neo-nazi groups, formations, brigades and battalions does Ukraine have? DOZENS.

TWO GROUPS vs DOZENS. Even your lib brain should be able to tell which number is higher. Or…maybe not?

But now riddle me this, how many Ukrainian groups are fighting under socialist banners and symbols? Where are all these based socialists in Ukraine?

At this point you think you can't change your mind, because that would mean that you supported Nazis before, so now you double down. It's ok, bro, one day you will look back and cringe at your support for Nazis. It's a part of growing up, I don't actually hold it against you.
>>

 No.456414

>>456412
I say kill the Nazis, but there are Ukrainians who are not affiliated dying aswell for what they think is defending their country from Putin's imperialism.

This pan-Russian bullshit is the same as fascism. I'm sick of seeing all of you commies supporting this shit blindly because of ideological fervor. Again, you are all praising a crypto-fascist Oligarch who has an obvious track record of manipulating information.

I do not care how many "Russians" on leftypol can claim that "most" people in Russia consume Western media and their media isn't as censored as we think. Obviously this is happening right under the noses of all of you smoothbrains. At the end of the day Putin is taking advantage of a population who were historically peasants until the turn of the 20th century.

What do you think about the Free Russian Battalion, and the REAL Chechens (not Kadyrov faggots who forgot what Putin did to their fathers) fighting against Putin on the side of Ukraine? Are they Nazis too?

There are also left-aligned groups fighting for Ukraine but they are not reported on, nor are they in large numbers. Because everyone won't shut up about Ukrainian Nazis.

It's not as black and white as everyone in Ukraine is a fucking Nazi.
>>

 No.456416

>>456414
>there are Ukrainians who are not affiliated dying aswell for what they think is defending their country
No shit. I feel for them. That is why I want them to stop dying needlessly for what is already a lost war. Does it bother you that rich Ukrainians are in Europe (you can leave as a fighting age male if you pay 2000€-10000€ at the border). In fact, Ukraine just passed a law that men can leave Ukraine if they pay a "deposit" of 200.000 hryvnas, in case they don't come back. The Ukrainians that can't afford it have to stay in the meat grinder. Slava Ukraine, right?
>Putin's imperialism.
<imperialism is when you invade a country
>This pan-Russian bullshit is the same as fascism.
Pan-Russian? That doesn't make sense, it's either pan-Slavic or Eurasian. You don't call it Eurasian because that would be admitting the multicultural character of it. Ironically, Russian nazis hate Putin precisely because he espouses Eurasian values, including multiculturalism. On the side of the Allies, you have Mongols (Tuvan), Angolans, Slavs, Arabs, Chechens, etc. An inconvenient fact for your narratice.
>I'm sick of seeing all of you commies
>you commies
Mask off moment
>supporting this shit blindly because of ideological fervor.
The only blind support I see is from the pro-Ukraine side, because you're blind to the Nazism. I actually hate Putin, the liberal asshole who participated in the destruction of the SU. he's better than the alternative though.
>Again, you are all praising a crypto-fascist Oligarch who has an obvious track record of manipulating information.
Ah yes, because Ukraine and NATO are not run by oligarchs and they don't manipulate information, right?
>I do not care how many "Russians" on leftypol can claim that "most" people in Russia consume Western media and their media isn't as censored as we think. Obviously this is happening right under the noses of all of you smoothbrains. At the end of the day Putin is taking advantage of a population who were historically peasants until the turn of the 20th century.
I follow only Western media, I can read between the lines though. Like that article about a Ukrainian goat that killed 30 Russians or the guy who shot down a fighter jet with a hunting rifle.
>What do you think about the Free Russian Battalion,
Lib/NATO psyop. One of the guys from that took credit for the attack on Dugina, said the "New Republican Army" is linked to the white-blue-white Russians fighting in Ukraine.
>and the REAL Chechens (not Kadyrov faggots who forgot what Putin did to their fathers) fighting against Putin on the side of Ukraine? Are they Nazis too?
No, they're not Nazis. But how many of them are there really? Just because they have an Instagram account doesn't mean they're a significant or influential group.
>There are also left-aligned groups fighting for Ukraine but they are not reported on, nor are they in large numbers.
VICE reported on them, said most of them joined right-wing formations, very anarchist, very socialist.
>Because everyone won't shut up about Ukrainian Nazis.
I wonder why… Western media before February couldn't shut up about them. Here's an article on the fucking ATLANTIC COUNCIL website from 2018 about Ukraine nazis.
https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/ukrainealert/ukraine-s-got-a-real-problem-with-far-right-violence-and-no-rt-didn-t-write-this-headline/
You can find countless others, just make sure the date is before February 2022.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/mar/13/ukraine-far-right-national-militia-takes-law-into-own-hands-neo-nazi-links

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/mar/02/neo-nazi-groups-recruit-britons-to-fight-in-ukraine

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-cohen-ukraine-commentary-idUSKBN1GV2TY

etc. etc.

It's pretty hilarious you didn't even notice the narrative shift.
>>

 No.456418

File: 1661353982570.jpg (147.17 KB, 640x948, friedrich-engels-1086023.jpg)

>>456395
>Authoritarianism needs to be crushed
No gods. No masters. No bedtimes.
>>

 No.456419

File: 1661354798976.png (698.3 KB, 2696x1268, screenshot.png)

The tankies at ogre having another normal one:
https://archive.ph/GOnSQ
https://leftypol.org/leftypol/res/1134998.html#1135100
>>

 No.456420

>>456419
Anon did you seriously black out your timezone in the screencap?
>>

 No.456421

File: 1661356175013-0.jpg (110.75 KB, 893x1139, 018729281.jpg)

File: 1661356175014-1.jpg (112.95 KB, 1125x1554, 636829171.jpg)

>>456410
Lmao Zlenskyyyyy literally posted a pic of a Nazi LARPer retard on his insta just this morning. And you can't tell me they didn't notice the symbol, they are intentionally trying to normalise neo-Naziism because those retards will make up a large part of the Ukrainian government after the war.
>>

 No.456422

>>456418
authoritarianism worked out pretty good for the soviets.
>>

 No.456423

>>456422
They lasted 70 years longer than the Paris Commune.
>>

 No.456424

>>456396
Russian's do talk about Ukrainians like how colonizers talk about indigenous people. Not sure what you're sperging out about.
>>

 No.456425

>>456419
OMG they're just coming out and saying imperialism=America.
>>

 No.456426

>>456423
70 more years of failure until the fall
>>

 No.456427

File: 1661360616001.jpeg (101.5 KB, 1024x576, d78938ce63fc6ff05a57cd366….jpeg)

>>456398
>Russia hates Nazis!
But has a fash biker gang operating as federales and Putin's brownshirts.
>>

 No.456428

>>456423
They also had the largest country in the world. Anyone could get a regime to last that long with that many resources.
>>

 No.456429

File: 1661362160286.jpg (1.44 MB, 2267x8334, f6d02cd86bb605ab133777970d….jpg)

>>456426
The Bolsheviks turned Russia from a feudal peasant state to an industrialised modern economy which eliminated illiteracy, homelessness and unemployment, as well as facilitating countless scientific advancements that have hugely benefitted mankind as a whole.

But enlighten me, what have anarchists achieved in their roughly 150 years of existence?
>>

 No.456430

>>456429
>He's trying to deflect criticism of the Soviets by making it a sectarian fight.
*Yawn* First off, the Soviet Union is gone so all the Red aesthetics you march around in are nothing more than costume bobbles.
Second all those things you state could be said about capitalism as well, so developing past feudalism isn't much of an achievement.
Third, WTF have tankies done in the last 30 years since the fall of the USSR. Anarchists successfully stopped the Alt Right, which is why Fox News, Trump, and even the current president still fume about Antifa and anarchists while the average person couldn't tell you what the USSR was much less a tankie.
>>

 No.456431

File: 1661364293789.jpg (1.69 MB, 1940x881, FAB-TANK-fire-cropped.jpg)

>>456430
>Second all those things you state could be said about capitalism as well
If it was left to capitalism Russia would probably look something like India now lmao. Has capitalism been successful in developing Africa, Latin America or much of Asia? No.
>Third, WTF have tankies done in the last 30 years since the fall of the USSR.
China has been popping off in that time and tankies still have significant political parties in most nations. The Communist Party remains the second largest political party in Russia. Oh and we took Nepal which was cool.
>Anarchists successfully stopped the Alt Right, which is why Fox News, Trump, and even the current president still fume about Antifa and anarchists while the average person couldn't tell you what the USSR was much less a tankie.
AHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHA
This has got to be bait or a copypasta or something lmao. It was the feds and the DNC who stopped the alt-right moron. All antifa did was push more people to vote trump because of how retarded they look to the average person. You cannot seriously believe that picrel stopped fascism in America or is seen as a credible threat by the US federal government. How detached from reality are you?
>>

 No.456432

>>456406
>MUH SYMBOLS!!!!!
meanwhile how many points of the Ur-Fascism checklist does Russian chauvinism nail?
<least superficial tankie
>>

 No.456433

>>456432
>Ur-Fascism checklist
Lol I stopped paying attention to that one after the mainstream left used it to definitively prove that trump is a fascist.
>>

 No.456434

>>456433
the checklist describes societies, not individuals, retard. you've clearly never read it
>>

 No.456435

>>456406
>Fascism and imperialist invasion is based when I just replace the aesthetic of the swastika with the hammer-sickle and call my foreign puppet states "people's republics" instead of "ubermensch living space" after annexing them by force
Literally Orwellian newspeak tier. Do tankies really?
>War is Peace
>Freedom is Slavery
>Ignorance is Strength
>>

 No.456436

>>456434
I know, but it's been applied to Trump and MAGA countless times making it a questionable measure.
>>

 No.456437

>NATOid vs. Tankie: The Thread
cringe and bluepilled
>>

 No.456438

File: 1661369264113.jpg (44.95 KB, 748x561, 1652387262632.jpg)

>>456430
>anarchists successfully stopped the alt right

I was on your side but this is some.reddit mega cringe. No one on the left has done anything remotely notable in the last 60 years. The left is dead bro. No one has "stopped the alt right" the material foundations for why the alt right exist have no been eliminated and the right has been gaining more and more ground did you not see jan 6th?

Wait do you think Joe Biden is an anarchist?
>>

 No.456439

>>456421
Notice how the libs and NATOids in this thread ignore this.

WHAT DO YOU THIN ABOUT ZELENSKY PROMOTING ACTUAL BONA FIDE NAZIS ON HIS OFFICIAL SOCIAL MEDIA?

SHOW ME PUTIN DOING THE SAME

>muh biker gang
Jesus, you libs are incorrigible.
>>

 No.456440

>>456439
wtf i love invading foreign countries and annexing territory now
>>

 No.456441

>>456438
>>456431
>Anarchists stop the Alt-Right movement fighting them in the streets.
>Oh no they didn't, LMAO, cringe, kek, hehe
This is the ultimate tankie cope. Anarchists stopped what could have been a major tragedy and did it without killing anyone.
Meanwhile all tankies are known for is larping and being abrasive weridos where they're known at all.
>>

 No.456442

>>456439
Niqqa that obscure Nazi symbol looks like a cliché family crest.
While you sperg out about some Facebook post The Night Wolves biker gang gets millions in contracts from Putin
>>

 No.456443

>>456440
>Russia has two tangentially nazi groups and a nationalist biker gang
<Nazi, imperialists, kill all Russians!
>president of Ukraine continuously promotes neo-nazis on his official social media accounts
<ummm sweaty, they are based freedom fighters
kys lib
>>

 No.456444

>>456351
>The sad part is you really think all these rhetorical tricks work, that you're dazzling your opponents into submission. When in reality all these hackneyed outbursts are about as convincing as a toddler smeared with chocolate denying they ate all the cookies.
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/russian-misinformation-seeks-to-confound-not-convince/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firehose_of_falsehood
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gish_gallop
>>

 No.456445

>>456442
>some Facebook post
<OFFICIAL ACCOUNT OF THE PRESIDENT OF UKRAINE
get fucked, you're too dishonest
>>

 No.456446

>>456431
>It was the feds
OMG
>and the DNC who stopped the alt-right moron.
Oh Jesus
>>

 No.456447

>>456444
It's not confounding though. To think so is the height of hubris. While Russian shills high five each other over their epic owning of the libs look more and more rabid to outsiders.
This lack of self awareness is endemic to all authoritarian regimes.
>>

 No.456448

File: 1661372189262-0.png (1.11 MB, 1200x675, ClipboardImage.png)

File: 1661372189262-1.png (500.09 KB, 590x750, ClipboardImage.png)

>>456441
>Meanwhile all tankies are known for is larping and being abrasive weridos where they're known at all.
This.
>"How cringe do you want your tankie larp?"
<"Just fuck my shit up"
>"Say no more"
>>

 No.456449

File: 1661372199984.jpg (68.64 KB, 634x544, 4EBF188900000578-6015749-i….jpg)

>>456443
>Russia has two tangentially nazi groups and a nationalist biker gang
A FASH biker gang that operates at the highest levels of government.

Point is if Putin thinks Nazis are so dangerous why has he integrated some into his own gov.
>>

 No.456451

File: 1661374196486.jpg (47.34 KB, 720x820, 69abdfd32ab679343fbb35f591….jpg)

>>456441
>Anarchists stopped what could have been a major tragedy
You stopped what exactly…? Trump getting elected for a second time?
I hate to break it to you anon, but it was the middle-class wine moms who come out in droves to vote for biden which defeated trump. Not you and your polycule whose "praxis" consists of shoplifting Smirnoff from convenience stores, having public sex orgies and graffiting ACAB onto the walls of abandoned buildings.
>and did it without killing anyone.
I mean, apart from that innocent black teenager you guys shot and killed in the CHAZ.
>Meanwhile all tankies are known for is larping and being abrasive weridos where they're known at all.
Anon that's literally the public perception of antifa for people who don't watch fox news.
>>

 No.456453

>>456441
Bro this is head canon kek
>>

 No.456454

>>456441
People who think in binaries like this are truly brain dead. I feel sorry for them. You are just as bad as the z larping tankie fags but in the other direction.
>>

 No.456455

>>456451
They stopped the alt right movement. That's a specific fascist American movement. Trump was a Republican and his views were always in line with that.
Richard Spencer used to be regularly interviewed by the mainstream media before his meme punch, and Hollywood actors used to admonish alt-right counter protests all the way until Charlottesville.
Point is, what in the fuck have tankies done. And you all like to post stuff about the Panthers dunking on anarchists but you all completely failed to support the Panthers at all even though they followed your ideology.
>>

 No.456456

>>456453
So you think the Alt Right went away on their own?
>>456454
I know there were other factors, but to think the Alt right would have been stopped without Antifa is cope.
>>

 No.456457

File: 1661376253826.png (234.17 KB, 600x600, 1654288161118.png)

>>456456
Retard, the alt right hasn't gone away. "The alt right" doesn't exist as a concept. You only have varying degrees of reactionism. If you think anti played this grand master role in degrading the "alt right" you live in a fantasy coomer land. It doesn't even matter cause these retards are still here and still influencing the republican party. Just because they got banned off your favorite coomer social media sites doesn't mean they don't exist.

Did you find us from org? That place is overflowing with reddit fags.
>>

 No.456458

>>456455
>>456455
If you genuinely think like this you are a time traveler from the past who came from 2014
>>

 No.456459

>>456457
All the original Alt-righers are gone, (Spencer, Milo, The Proud Boys). I never said that Antifa defeated fascism just the Alt-Right movement.
You're coping if you don't think the fascist movement would be a lot stronger if their original momentum hadn't been sabotaged.
>>456458
Does bringing up anarchist successes make tankies feel impotent or something. Grow up, I really don't care who ultimately fights the right, I'll give them critical support regardless.
>>

 No.456460

>>456430
>Anarchists successfully stopped the Alt Right
Fucking retard lol
>>

 No.456461

>>456443
sweet, tankies can invent and debunk liberal arguments in realtime now
>>

 No.456463

>>456459
Go back to reddit
>>

 No.456464

File: 1661377566434.jpg (288.5 KB, 1908x1146, U.jpg)

>>456461
>>456463
>t. brainlets
>>

 No.456465

>>456459
Fascism and people like the alt right are going to propagate and exist as long as the material conditions for them to exist exist. Read Marx you unbelievably retarded idealistic faggot.
Milo and figure heads like trump were just that. Figure heads. It's like blaming Jews for the state of the world today. You remove one figure head and the organization itself still will remain and even if you removed the organizations something else will just take their place because you are not solving the actual fundemental root issue.

I'm not a tankie you bathering retard. Anyone who disagrees with you is not the enemy. Disagreement is important for development on the left. I believe in a lot of anarchistic principles but I won't call myself an anarchist because to lock yourself in the ideological cage of 20th century revolutionary moments in history is antithetical to the current state of the world and our historical period.

The alt right is fine and your little shit fit cringe CHAZ occupation has had little effect. Cope and seethe.
>>

 No.456466

>>456430
>>456459
>>456464
Who the fuck cares that some 17 to 20 something year old male delinquents got into street fights with fascists?
>>

 No.456467

>>456465
>Fascism and people like the alt right are going to propagate and exist as long as the material conditions for them to exist exist. Read Marx you unbelievably retarded idealistic faggot.
Yes, I remember Marx distinctly saying you should sit on your hands while fascist and other booj goons take over the street.
You're getting bent out of shape for me recognizing the single significant contribution that anarchists have made.
By your logic I shouldn't rescue a kid from a burning building, because *harrumph* that doesn't change the capitalist mode of production that created the material conditions of the house fire to begin with, I mean the kid will just inevitably find themselves another dangerous situation created by capitalists.
You say you're not a tankie but you're still full of shit whatever your motivations may be.
>>

 No.456474

>>456467
>By your logic I shouldn't rescue a kid from a burning building
Pretty clear you don't know what an analogy is because saving a kid from a building on fire is entirely different than stopping fascists from gaining members, it's entirely out of our control, you fucking retard.
>>

 No.456475

From what I've seen Antifa are closer to drop out and drug culture compared to pro-revolutionaries. These people aren't doing anyone a service by fight other delinquents on the street.
>>

 No.456476

>>456475
Antifa, especially in America, has become a bunch of pussies who forget what the movement really means. Same goes for most people who identify with the left so much it becomes a dogmatic circle jerk, like the tankies in this thread, or the CHAZ anarchists.

The post-left is honestly right, for the most part.
>>

 No.456477

>>456476
Couldn't agree more.

First as a tragedy, then as a farce.
>>

 No.456481

>>456476
>>456477
There is no guarantee that humanity will progress, for all we know we could be on the brink of eco-fascist states fighting water wars. The past 160 something years have shown that mass movements during the time people aren't starving or the elite classes aren't discredited and seen as frauds will fail. All we can do is keep class class analysis alive amongst the entire radical network and to thus to attract as many fellow wanderers to revolutionary positions as possible. Although it is essential that we try to increase the numbers of conscious revolutionaries we cannot expect a mass revolutionary movement to arise until the economy finds itself in serious trouble and the bosses start losing control of us.
>>

 No.456483

>>456481
That's exactly the problem. The revolution most likely will never happen so instead of larping or using it as an identity when it's something largely risen from a world vastly different than ours now, realign your perception of what the left really is and should be. You don't need to be a radical militant authoritarian totalitarian who wants to crush the status quo like most tankies think. I really dislike the dynamic of I have to rely on communists to ultimately reach my goal in societal and political philosophy. I'd rather die than end up in some Orwellian dystopia if we go to Marx's step 1 to achieve a better world, and it becomes corrupt like anything humans get their grubby hands on.

Start by defining the present, and how to move forward based off of that. The political spectrum is an illusion, and relying on the proletariat or the revolution is antiquated and almost conservative in retrospect.

And if the economy collapses in a nigh-apocalyptic form to rouse a mass response, there will either be a power vacuum where everyone and their little niche-ideologies will be killing eachother, or we just move a small step to the left or right without abandoning what "has worked before". It's called the status quo for a reason, and the nature of human belief/greed will always suit the existence of one. Laissez-faire was a radical liberal idea at one time, people's perception of things dictate shift in trends rather than outright fighting the system. The system will just fight you back in the meantime, until people's perceptions collectively change regardless of needs in most cases.

So yeah, maybe awareness is the best solution we have for now. Though, it can be taken further than that instead of waiting around for the revolution like I said.
>>

 No.456486

>>456483

The issue is that tankies and anarkiddies turn to history and attempt to replicate it and apply it to the modern world. Either through a sense of nostalgia for something they never had, or, for ultra-leftist adventurist purposes.

We should study and learn from history, but, to LARP like you are in the October revolution or 1936 Catalonia is not only cringe but counter productive. Behavior like your average anti-faggot turns people off and makes the left look insane and the same is true for CPI wannabe bolsheviks. It's anti-dialectical.
>>

 No.456487

>>456474
No it's really not, because there's was an immediate danger in the Alt-Right gaining strength, and a short term solution was applied.
But since it didn't bring about Socialism fully formed you're shitting clearly out of insecurity of whatever praxis you subscribe to.
>>

 No.456488

>>456487
*you're shitting on it
>>

 No.456489

>>456474
>it's entirely out of our control, you fucking retard.
No it wasn't since the Alt-Right was put down.
>>456476
>Muh CHAZ
CHAZ was a success, albeit a fleeting one. Police were driven out of one of the largest cities in America, which is unprecedented in modern times.
The "CHAZ was hecken cringe" are just buthurt from Nazis on 4chan that your fash sympathies cause you to empathize with.
>>

 No.456490

>>456489
Yes racially segregated gardening. What a success. I refuse to believe you are anything but a troll at this point.
>>

 No.456495

>>456489
I'm not a fascist sympathizer and I'm actually left-libertarian (libertarian socialist, or anarcho-socialist so I can define it to avoid you playing semantics) if I were to want to wholly identify with an ideology you dickhead. To even go further, I'm half black so sympathizing with fascists is literally going against my existence. It's just that CHAZ was not a good example of application as it was in reaction to events at the time, at the end of the day they still had problems with it. They got rid of the police woo-hoo, but they had no one of actual experience to replace them as a functioning entity besides just some dudes with guns making calculations based off of feelings like most human beings. Since again, it was an in the moment idea and that's all they had at the time.

I'm overly critical of any and every ideology and its application because no matter how much you want to wrap it up with a ribbon it's going to be flawed in some way. If everyone with a differing opinion than you is a fascist sympathizer then I pitty your ability to critically think and form arguments.
>>

 No.456496

>>456449
>A FASH biker gang that
What makes them fash? Their scary orthodox cross or their scary black clothes?
>operates at the highest levels of government
Just because there's a pic of them shaking hands with Putin, doesn't mean they "operate at the highest level of government." LOL

Svoboda party is explicitly neo-nazi and they are actually in the Ukrainian parliament. Try agajn lib.
>>

 No.456498

File: 1661435185039.jpg (116.62 KB, 1245x830, 1661433628958.jpg)

Wagner Nazis with their fascist symbol of hate. USSR was just like the Nazis. Vote blue no matter who this November.
>>

 No.456500

File: 1661438473944.jpg (53.51 KB, 372x527, 25c152f05db607899e97d2b75b….jpg)

>Tell me what anarchists have achieved in the last 150 years
<We got Milo banned from facebook, hit someone with a bikelock and tried to make an anti-racist commune but ended up shooting a random black teenager
Do anarkiddies really?
>>

 No.456501

File: 1661438921695.mp4 (6.02 MB, 848x480, 1661437369496.mp4)

>I am Azerbaijani, I am Armenian, I am Uzbek, I am Georgian, I am Kazakh, I am Jewish, I am Chechen, I am Tatar, I am Ossetian, I am Moldovan, I am Tajik, I am Udmurt, we are Russian!
More Nazi propaganda out of Russia. Look at this race mixing and civic nationalism, just like Hitler imagined.
>>

 No.456502

>>456501
>one Turkman
>one East Asian
Where are the African Russians? The Arab Muslims? The churkas? Looks like a lot of white Europeans to me.
>>

 No.456504

>>456501
How many military deaths do Moscow and St. Petersburg have compared to Buryatia, Dagestan and press ganged Ukrainian conscripts from occupied Donbass?
>>

 No.456505

>>456501
Who's being sent to the frontlines of Putin's war of choice? And who isn't? Civic nationalism? Or herrenvolk nationalism?
>>

 No.456506

File: 1661448737158.png (655.77 KB, 976x850, ClipboardImage.png)

>thousands of teenagers wearing near-identical black shirts (with logo "Putin team") marching in formation and giving pre-coordinated shouts and salutes
Ah, yes. Very subtle and not-fascist. Do tankies really?
>>

 No.456507

Did tankies not get the memo that 1930's style heavy-handed propaganda is incredibly gauche and passé for people who aren't terminally online weirdos? >>456448
>>

 No.456508

>>456506
>fascism is when political rally and salute
>>

 No.456509

>>456508
>political rally and salute in support of an imperialist invasion for "racial living space"
ftfy
>>

 No.456510

>>456509
>imperialist invasion
An imperialist invasion supported by all anti-imperialist governments?
>for "racial living space"
Lmao where did you read that, reddit? The Ukrainians have been waging a racially motivated war against the Donbass republics for 8 years, but I'm sure you never cared much about that.
>>

 No.456511

>>456340
Kek
>>

 No.456512

>>456496
>>A FASH biker gang that
>What makes them fash?
Oh just the fact that they Putin's personal brownshirts, have the de facto legal authority of federal police and receive direct funding via gov contracts.
Oh yeah one last thing,
THEY ARE A 1% CRIMINAL MOB WHOSE RACKETS OF HUMAN,AND DRUG TRAFFICKING OPPRESS RUSSIAN PROLES
>>

 No.456513

>>456500
>Fash are harmless even while using the most powerful communications tech ever convinced by man tee hee.
t. fash appeaser
>>

 No.456514

>>456496
>Svoboda party is explicitly neo-nazi
No they are not you liar, they are ultranationalist, kinda like Putin hmmmmmmm.
>and they are actually in the Ukrainian parliament.
They have one seat kek.
>>

 No.456515

>>456510
>The Ukrainians have been waging a racially motivated war against the Donbass republics for 8 years,
Is that why they left all the other Russians in Ukraine alone lol.
>>

 No.456519

File: 1661455490482.png (365.9 KB, 525x636, aef0ad70a274403cf535c747b6….png)

>>456513
Banning fash from social media doesn't do shit. You need to change the material conditions that facilitate their existence, believing that lobbying big tech to ban them is some huge victory for socialism is just idealist nonsense.

The Prussian government tried their damn hardest to censor Marx and other radicals. However, they had very little success because it was the conditions of 19th century capitalism which gave birth to revolutionary political thinkers like Marx and made the population so receptive to his ideas. Their problem wasn't that newspapers were giving Marx a platform, their problem was that the capitalist system in Prussia bred class conflict and discontent towards the ruling elite.
>>

 No.456520

>>456510
>pretending to not know about "le Russkiy mir", massacre of Ukrainian civilians, forcible relocation of hundreds of thousands of Ukrainian civilians to Russian concentration camps ("filtration camps") and forcibly separating Ukrainian children from their families to be raised by Russian families and "Russified"
>being this disingenuous
As expected of a tankie
>>

 No.456524

>>456519
>Banning fash from social media doesn't do shit.
Yeah bullshit, this is like saying it doesn't matter that the booj own all the television stations.
And they were kicked off the street not social media, nice attempt at a strawman though.
>You need to change the material conditions that facilitate their existence,
Fash in the streets is a material condition.
>The Prussian government tried their damn hardest to censor Marx and other radicals…and more pseud Hegelian dialetics.
Propaganda and media have empirically inordinate power. A Marxist analysis requires you to look at data now instead of using what Marx said in the past as some kind of prophet.
Regardless the Alt-Right extended far beyond social media and had a long list of harassment, assaults and even murders attributed to them. 8chan on it's own was responsible for goading two mass shooters.
So yeah your little paternalist shaming tactics don't fool anyone, the Alt-Right had blood one their hands, were poised to repeat the path to power other fash have successfully taken and you're trying to diminish that fact with out right lies.
>>

 No.456525

>>456519
It also makes porky emboldened to I censor us.
>>

 No.456526

>>456519
Okay so it was the conditions of the capitalist information age that caused the Alt-Right to be crushed by Antifa.
If you're going to boil down even individual group accomplishments to class dialogs than Antifa was a class expression of anti-fash solidarity. But that gives them more legitimacy not less since you and other critics always paint them as fringe.
>>

 No.456527

File: 1661458083608.jpg (203.04 KB, 1024x836, 1654300163185.jpg)

>>456524
>OOOOO WE GOT SOME REDNECK BANNED IFF OUR VERY NICHE TWITTER PLATFORM NO PASARIAN

>WE DID IT GUYS WERE JUST LIKE CAROLINIAN REVOLUTIONARIES
>>

 No.456528

>>456527
Chuck's
>>

 No.456529

>>456510
Faggot, it's Putin's meddling that started that because of his ethnic Russian fetish. He took advantage of the political instability in Ukraine because the east was just more pro-Russian in terms of politics not in ethnic ideologies. The first units to enter combat in the east were mainly Russian troops under no banner, and Nazis like Rusich.
>>

 No.456530

>>456528
Sneed
>>

 No.456531

>>456520
Bro that's a CIA psyop bro cmon bro. Stop being a NATOid bro. You imperialist. Bro, cmon bro. You dumb lib.

The far left and far right are the fuckin same with this bullshit.
>>

 No.456532

>>456530
FUCK
>>

 No.456533

File: 1661461151925.webm (1.29 MB, 854x480, 1660948635795338.webm)

>>456520
What's the "Russkiy mir", massacre?
>>

 No.456534

>>456533
I want to have sex with that
>>

 No.456535

>>456534
Latex fucking freaks me out
No thanks. I had a buddy of mine that was into this shit.
Super creepy.
>>

 No.456536

>>456512
>fascism is when you do crime
wow, you should write a book.
>>

 No.456537

>>456514
>No they are not you liar, they are ultranationalist
<unironically defending nazis
lib moment
>They have one seat kek.
ok, that means they are in the government. thanks for agreeing with me, I guess. how many seats in the Duma do the biker gang and Wagner have?
>>

 No.456538

>>456536
>Oh so you think biker gangs are fash because they violently oppress workers on behalf of oligarchs.
>>

 No.456539

>>456538
You just described Ukraine. Go see what Azov, C14, Pravy Sektor, etc. did. Oligarchs created those, recruited ultras and then literally defended their businesses. Ukraine is like Russia, but way way worse. The fact you can't see that is fucking scary. You're defending nazis, plain and simple. You'll catch up in a couple of years.
>>

 No.456540

>>456537
>lib moment
They kicked out members with neo Nazi ties.
>ok, that means they are in the government.
Yes, but they're not explicitly Nazis like you said earlier.
>I guess. how many seats in the Duma do the biker gang and Wagner have?
Lol, so you measure political power by seats in a Parliament and not a monopoly on violence and wealth lol.
>>

 No.456541

>>456539
Zelensky doesn't hold nearly as much power as Putin does in Russia. And once again you tankies are strawmanning your critics because it's all you can do. Ukraine does have fash in their gov, but so does Putin which shows how much of a sham their de-nazifiction talk is.
>>

 No.456542

>>456533
>doesn't know what a comma is
>I can't sneed!
>>

 No.456547

File: 1661481254073.jpg (92.06 KB, 827x1021, trashy-wxgvyr.jpg)

>>456539
>You're defending nazis, plain and simple. You'll catch up in a couple of years.
>>

 No.456548

File: 1661482622401-0.png (1.11 MB, 1600x1066, ClipboardImage.png)

File: 1661482622401-1.png (1.83 MB, 1600x1066, ClipboardImage.png)

File: 1661482622401-2.png (1.32 MB, 1600x1066, ClipboardImage.png)

https://www.foreignaffairs.com/russian-federation/world-putin-wants-fiona-hill-angela-stent
>The World Putin Wants
<How Distortions About the Past Feed Delusions About the Future
Good read and interesting analysis.
>>

 No.456549

File: 1661499998679-0.jpg (2.82 MB, 4272x2848, 9k=(40).jpg)

File: 1661499998679-1.jpg (53.75 KB, 624x351, 9k=(41).jpg)

File: 1661499998679-2.jpg (33.89 KB, 640x446, Z(33).jpg)

>>456540
>they're not explicitly Nazis
<pic related, Oleh Tyahnybok, founder of Svoboda doing an ultranationalist salute.
>This is Oleh Tyahnybok, he has claimed a "Moscow-Jewish mafia" rule Ukraine and that "Germans, Kikes and other scum" want to "take away our Ukrainian state."

>Svoboda is Ukraine’s fourth biggest party holding 36 seats out of 450 in parliament. They're also part of the Alliance of European National Movements along with the BNP and Jobbik.
36 seats in Parliament, not 1. Uh oh, who is the liar now?
>their old logo, a Wolfsangel rune, a common symbol for European neo-Nazi organizations.

https://libcom.org/article/neo-nazis-and-far-right-protesters-ukraine
>inb4 libcom is Russian propaganda.

You're whitewashing ACTUAL NAZIS, how does it feel?

>so you measure political power by seats in a Parliament and not a monopoly on violence and wealth lol.
Dude, Oleh Tyahnybok met with Biden and McCain. And yes, neo-nazis in Ukraine have a monopoly on violence.

>The party has often staged commemorations honouring Ukrainian nationalist leader Stepan Bandera and the Ukrainian Insurgent Army (UPA).

>The party seeks to put a stop to immigration into Ukraine, and to make sure that only ethnic Ukrainians can be employed as civil servants.[137]

>Svoboda has been described as an antisemitic and sometimes a neo-Nazi party by some journalists,[132][137][150] organizations that monitor hate speech,[151] Jewish organizations,[152][153] and political opponents.[48]

Svoboda advisor Yuriy Mykhalchyshyn started a blog called "'Joseph Goebbels Political Research Centre" in 2005, later changing "Joseph Goebbels" to "Ernst Jünger."[3

>Thirty members of the Israeli Knesset condemned the party in a signed letter addressed to the President of the European Parliament. In the letter the Israeli politicians accused Svoboda of "openly glorifying Nazi murder" and "Nazi war criminals".[citation needed] In May 2013 the World Jewish Congress labelled the party as "neo-Nazi" and called for European governments to ban them.[167]

STOP DEFENDING NAZIS
>>

 No.456550

>>456541
>Ukraine does have fash in their gov, but so does Putin
source?
>>456547
>Z
wow, that's like, worse than the swastika. You're just repeating twitter lib takes.
>>

 No.456552

>twitter-tier posts about muh tankies
>unironic pro-dugin shilling
>muh multipolarity
>simping for the EU
>muh denazification
>defending ukrainian neo-nazis
This thread fucking sucks.
>>

 No.456553

>>456548
>On the eve of the invasion, Putin gave a speech accusing Bolshevik leader Vladimir Lenin of destroying the Russian empire by launching a revolution during World War I and then “separating, severing what is historically Russian land.” As Putin put it, “Bolshevik, Communist Russia” created “a country that had never existed before”—Ukraine—by wedging Russian territories such as the Donbas region, a center of heavy industry, into a new Ukrainian socialist republic. In fact, Lenin and the Bolsheviks essentially recreated the Russian empire and just called it something else. They established separate Soviet Socialist Republics for Ukraine and other regions to contrast themselves with the imperial tsars, who reigned over a united, Russified state and oppressed ethnic minorities. But for Putin, the Bolsheviks’ decision was illegitimate, robbing Russia of its patrimony and stirring “zealous nationalists” in Ukraine, who then developed dangerous ideas of independence. Putin claims he is reversing these century-old “strategic mistakes.”
But tankies told me Putin loved the USSR.
>>

 No.456554

>>456549
>36 seats in Parliament, not 1. Uh oh, who is the liar now?
The article you cite was written I. 2014, as of the 2019 election they have one seat.
><pic related, Oleh Tyahnybok, founder of Svoboda doing an ultranationalist salute
That's not the same thing as an explicitly Nazi party platform.
>>

 No.456556

>>456554
>not explicitly nazi
Can you not read?
>their old logo, a Wolfsangel rune, a common symbol for European neo-Nazi organizations
<Nazi logo ✓
>The party has often staged commemorations honouring Ukrainian nationalist leader Stepan Bandera and the Ukrainian Insurgent Army (UPA)
<celebrating nazis and nazi collaborators ✓
>to make sure that only ethnic Ukrainians can be employed as civil servants.
<racial laws and excluding minorities from government ✓
>Svoboda advisor Yuriy Mykhalchyshyn started a blog called "'Joseph Goebbels Political Research Centre"
<fans of Goebbels ✓
>In the letter the Israeli politicians accused Svoboda of "openly glorifying Nazi murder" and "Nazi war criminals".[citation needed] In May 2013 the World Jewish Congress labelled the party as "neo-Nazi"
<recognised as neo-Nazi by several groups ✓
Ah yeah, but because they don't come out and openly say "Yes, we are actual Nazis" you don't think they are. A biker gang wearing black and doing crime is totally Nazi though.
>>

 No.456557

>>456556
>>their old logo, a Wolfsangel rune, a common symbol for European neo-Nazi organizations.
Again, that's not the same as having an EXPLICIT (your words not mine) Nazi platform.
They're ethnic ultranationalists, so exactly like Putin.
>>Svoboda advisor Yuriy Mykhalchyshyn started a blog called "'Joseph Goebbels Political Research Centre"
Yes but the leader of the party Tyahnybok expelled fash groups in the party. Meanwhile Putin give multi-million dollar gov contract to a fash biker gang.
>Tyahnybok was elected in 2004 as the president of the party and shortly after he made efforts to moderate the party's image by changing the party's name and symbols and expelling neo-Nazi and neofascist groups.
http://www.isn.ethz.ch/Digital-Library/Publications/Detail/?lng=en&id=137051
><recognised as neo-Nazi by several groups
Like I said, they have one seat out of 450. But the Night Wolves biker gang has unfettered police power throughout Russia.
>>

 No.456558

>>456557
>still defending Nazis
I'm done with you.
>>

 No.456560

>>456558
>Nooooo you can't stop me from smearing 40 million people as Nazis.
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 No.456561

File: 1661556267872.png (3.04 MB, 1984x1116, ClipboardImage.png)

How does a single mobile missile launcher cause so much sneed?
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 No.456562

File: 1661563923496.png (274.26 KB, 933x329, zzzzzzz.png)

Loosers
>>

 No.456563

>>456562
Imagine coming all the way here to say and post this. Deff under age ban.
>>

 No.456564

>>456557
Putin's advisor is literally a fucking Altra nationalist evangelical extremist. Dugin is nuts and thinks he's telepathic or some crazy shit. Retards who defend Russia are totally brain dead.
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 No.456565

>>

 No.456566

>>456561
The west has awesome propaganda, it apparently managed to convince some people that a hand full of missile launchers were going to turn the tide on a war.
>>

 No.456567

>>456566
ha, nice try Putin shill. pro-ruSSian bots posting means the HIMARS are working. ruSSia's army is about to collapse.
>>

 No.456568

>>456567
>ha, nice try Putin shill.
I'm just disagreeing with you, this is so tiresome.

> pro-ruSSian bots posting means the HIMARS are working
Retarded logic, it would imply that the Russian military was intentionally leaking tactical information via propaganda operations, why would they do that ?

>ruSSia's army is about to collapse.
I'm probably going to regret asking , but why do you think this ?
>>

 No.456569

>>456568
>why would they do that ?
>expecting ruZZians to act logically
they bombed a fucking nuclear plant

>why do you think this ?
their offensive stalled, they suffered over 160.000 casualties, Putin just signed a decree to recruit another 130.000, military infrastructure all over ruSSia is burning, they moved all the planes from Crimea, ruSSian troops are stuck at Kherson, Ukraine is pushing them back. why would NATO and Zelensky say Ukraine will win back Crimea unless the ruSSians were about to get their shit pushed in?

you lost, v*tnik, deal with it.

slava ukraini, heroyam slava
>>

 No.456570

>>456569
This. Also don't forget the Russians are literally stripping passenger jets for parts as the sanctions are fucking up their supply chains for critical mil-tech components.
>>

 No.456572

>>456569
>they bombed a fucking nuclear plant
I think you got that mixed up, Russian soldiers were in the Zaporizhzhia nuclear plant and the Ukrainians were the ones that shelled it with artillery. That nuclear plant was build to withstand a lot, but it was still reckless of the Ukrainians to attack it. They (including Zelensky) officially admitted doing this.
>their offensive stalled
The goal of the Russians wasn't capturing territory, their goal was to wear down the Ukrainian military forces, and they are succeeding at that.
>they suffered over 160.000 casualties
The estimations for the losses on the Ukrainian side range between 80k and 150k
The Russian losses are estimated to be below 10k
>why would NATO and Zelensky say Ukraine will win back Crimea unless the ruSSians were about to get their shit pushed in?
Are you seriously asking why war propagandists would lie about loosing a war ?

I've been trying to get reasonably accurate information about this war, Russia seems to be winning. Even the mainstream press in the west which has a very strong pro-Ukraine bias, is admitting that it's not going well for Ukraine.

I don't know your motivations but if i had to guess, the narrative that Ukraine can still will is designed to function as an obstacle to diplomacy and peace negotiations.
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 No.456573

>>456572
>the narrative that Ukraine can still will is designed to function as an obstacle to diplomacy and peace negotiations.
good, Nazi Putin and his gang of fascist goons need to be stopped. you're probably a burger, so you don't care, but as someone who lives in Europe I don't want to be a victim of ruSSian imperialism and their Greater ruZZia ambitions. Putin literally said he wants to establish the ruZZian empire and he's using his Wagner Nazis and Kirill Goebbels to achieve it.
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 No.456577

>>456573
When did Putin say this? Please source your claims.
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 No.456578

File: 1661616671266.jpg (178.17 KB, 1526x1178, NonCredibleDefense-wz0g2j.jpg)

>>

 No.456579

File: 1661619772104.jpg (467.72 KB, 1580x1340, 1661618158427092.jpg)

Tankies in a nutshell
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 No.456583

File: 1661647122961.png (853.33 KB, 970x647, ClipboardImage.png)

https://www.usnews.com/news/world/articles/2022-08-26/russia-cant-stop-war-even-if-ukraine-drops-nato-hopes-putin-ally
That idiot Medvedev just said the quiet part out loud. Wasn't one of their original excuses for invading Ukraine to stop NATO expansion? If you're telling us a stop to NATO expansion won't halt your attack then logically it means your original stated intent was a lie.

Is it a requirement for Russian politicians to be stupider than shit in order to get elected?
>>

 No.456585

>>456583
Not neccesarily as the party attacking could now see no point in a cease fire. I mean it's pretty dumb to try and deny the invasion was over NATO. The United States should never have tried to absorb ukraine into nato too start with.
>>

 No.456605

>>456579
boomer post
>>

 No.456641

>>456579
>muh tankies
>muh night wolves
>muh wagner
that has been your whole contribution in three threads lol
>>

 No.456652

>>456641
>muh night wolves
Yes, do you think the presence of fascism is measured by the number of groups and not how much power they have.
You have still failed to reconciled the fact that a 1% criminal biker gang receives millions in gov contracts and is Putin's personal paramilitary force.
>>

 No.456660

>>456652
>biker gang vs neo-nazi party in government
<liberals: I can't tell the difference between these two
lol, scratch that
<liberals: bikers are worse
>>

 No.456668

>>456660
Yes a 1% fascist criminal biker gang acting as the the personal paramilitary arm for a dictator and ao are abouve the law l, is worse than a democratically elected ultra national party with one single seat that can still be voted out.
>>

 No.456671

>>456668
>democratically elected
lie, no democracy in Ukraine since the US hand-picked their government after their Maidan coup
>ultra national party
<carrying water for neo-nazis
I've already posted how many international groups called them neo-nazi.
>with one single seat
disingenuous, after 2014 they had over 50,including 4 ministerial positions in the government.
>that can still be voted out.
<just voodoot
<voot bloo no matter whoo
You libs are fucking pathetic.
>>

 No.456672

>>456671
>lie, no democracy in Ukraine since the US hand-picked their government after their Maidan coup
<People protesting for months in sub-zero temperatures was the machination of the CIA and not popular sentiment.
Keep telling yourself that tankie.
>ultra national party
<carrying water for neo-nazis
They're ultra nationalists like Putin.
>I've already posted how many international groups called them neo-nazi.
Niqqa I am not going to analyze whatever obscure group you dug up that called them Nazis.
Post some actual legislation that they actually tried to pass that could be called Nazi.
Being anti-immigration doesn't make you a Nazi, if it did the GOP would be Nazis too.
>that can still be voted out.
<just voodoot
<voot bloo no matter whoo
More remarks from the tankie peanut gallery. It's easy to be a purist when you don't actually put any real power into the hands of workers.
>>

 No.456673

>>456671
>disingenuous, after 2014 they had over 50,including 4 ministerial positions in the government.
Yeah it's 2022 now and they have one seat.
Also what else happened in 2014 that could have prompted some people in Ukraine to adopt an Ultra Nationalist stance hmmmmmm
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 No.456692

File: 1662100599337.webm (8.19 MB, 512x401, Left-Forum-Cockshott-demo….webm)

>democracy is when elections
No.
>>

 No.456693

>>456673
>Also what else happened in 2014 that could have prompted some people in Ukraine to adopt an Ultra Nationalist stance hmmmmmm
CIA activated its Ukrainian assets, organised a coup with the US State Department and armed neo-nazis.

Bow you're going to defend US imperialism and coups, because it's against evil Ruskis.
>>

 No.456694

>>456693
>Bow you're going to defend US imperialism and coups,
No one wants to be poor af under Russia's thumb LMAO. You don't need the CIA to make workers want to be middle class.
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 No.456695

>>456692
Based sortition chad
>>

 No.456696

>>456672
I mean color revolutions DO happen. It's not that the CIA is protesting rather they could be fanning the flames and considering the history of the CIA I wouldn't be the least bit surprised.
>>

 No.456699

>>456696
Yes but that doesn't mean every protest you don't like is a glowie op.
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 No.456701

File: 1662152772337.png (576.6 KB, 650x487, 1654304162904.png)

>>456699
Sure that's true also (Not him) but you have to gauge them and like I said I wouldn't be surprised on this one. Of course the US media is going to blow things out of proportion they don't like. The US media is the 5th branch of the US government.

They are going to make it se bigger than it is regardless. Russia will do the same. This is how propoganda works. If you understand the historical and material context of the conflict between the US and Russia then you can understand why it isn't very surprising, tbh.
>>

 No.456702

>>456694
>American imperialism raises people out of poverty and into the middle class
That's why Iraq is a paradise today. I told you not to defend American imperialism and there you go defending American imperialism.
>>

 No.457240

>>456702
Not defending the Iraq war, but Iraqis today make about 5x what they did under Saddam. Liberalism is still better than dictatorships.
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 No.457274

>>457240
>Iraqis today make about 5x what they did under Saddam
Anon…
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 No.457282

>>457240
Iraq doesn't exist, you idiot. They're in the midst of a civil war. Extremists are going to come to power in Iraq, just like the Taliban did in Afghanistan, because they will promise peace and stability. People will run to them because turns out liberalism, women's rights and gay marriage don't mean much to people who don't have water, electricity and are in danger of being killed every day. I'd say you libs are delusional, but you aren't, you hold the opinions of someone who lives a comfortable life in the West, and directly benefits from the plunder of the "developing world".
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 No.457283

>>457282
>Iraq doesn't exist, you idiot
It does, and you're being dramatic. It survived ISIS, and it will survive this.
>>

 No.457291

>>457282
>Man
<Mocks women’s rights
<Le westernoid fag to care about things like women’s rights
>>

 No.457295

>>457283
The "Iraqi government" is not even in control of Baghdad. Iraq never really existed, Saddam kept it united with a little genociding of Kurds with Western chemical weapons thrown in.

"Iraq" was formed when Brits drew a straight line through the map, not caring about tribes or their territory. The Iraqi army ran from ISIS and left them loads of US equipment because they weren't loyal to an "Iraq". You libs think that everyone thinks in terms of nation-states.
>>

 No.457297

>>457291
the point
(You)

US and Western libs wanted US to continue the occupation of Afghanistan, citing "women's rights" and saying the West should impose Western liberal values on the Afghan people. And they wanted Afghans to fight for those rights and values. Afghani people said fuck that and put the Taliban back in power, kicking out the US. "Nation building" simply doesn't work when done by a conquering force.
>>

 No.457299

>>457297
So you think the Afghans are a backwards people incapable of liberalism? Because that's what it sounds like. Also, if the US had an occupation to free a minority population, I would support that. Human rights are more important than whatever the fuck you're smoking.
>>

 No.457302

>>457295
>The "Iraqi government" is not even in control of Baghdad
Oh, and I guess the US government is not even in control of DC. You're delusional.
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 No.457304

File: 1663180238710.gif (2.03 MB, 640x480, 1650275970061.gif)

>>457299
>So you think the Afghans are a backwards people incapable of liberalism?
I'm saying they're more advanced than you because they reject liberalism.
>Because that's what it sounds like.
Work on your reading comprehension.
>Also, if the US had an occupation to free a minority population, I would support that.
<I support the US invading countries, but not Russia invading countries
Russia invaded to help a minority, btw.
>Human rights are more important than whatever the fuck you're smoking.
<Imperialism is more important than whatever the fuck you're smoking.
>>

 No.457305

>>457304
>I'm saying they're more advanced than you because they reject liberalism.
Ah, yes. Forcing women into illiteracy is so based and socialist, bro. Nice of of /pol/ memes, as if gay marriage was a bad thing.
>>

 No.457306

>>457305
Marx deff said this
>>

 No.457307

>>457306
Marx thought the US was based for going to war with the South. Engels also thought the Mexican-American war was based. Looks to me, like to be a socialist, you have to be pro-America.
>>

 No.457309

>>457307
>Looks to me, like to be a socialist, you have to be pro-America
No.
>>

 No.457310

>>457309
I think I'll listen to Marx and Engels over some faggot on the internet, thanks.
>>

 No.457311

>>457310
Okay? America is not the same nation it was when Marx wrote you retard. You're just another random idiot on the internet, you don't have any authority over who is a socialist. You and everything you'll say will be shit, you've already exposed yourself a fraud without a brain.
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 No.457312

File: 1663189650291.jpg (31.48 KB, 540x540, sistine-fibel-smug-rokuden….jpg)

>>457311
>Okay? America is not the same nation it was when Marx wrote you retard.
It literally has the same constitution. It's been one continuous nation the whole time.
>you've already exposed yourself a fraud without a brain.
Tell that to Marx and Engels, who agree with me and not you.
>>

 No.457313

>>457305
>liberalism is when women's rights
your brain is broken
>>

 No.457314

>>457313
Literally yes. Liberalism is about individual rights, and women are individuals, not property. Sorry that you're such a fucking reactionary, comrade.
>>

 No.457315

>>457314
I made you look stupid and now you're putting words in my mouth as some kind of gotcha.
>>

 No.457316

File: 1663190928129.jpg (89.16 KB, 1200x675, Exf0lUDUcAYTS6o[1].jpg)

>>457315
I'm sorry, but I'm not the one disagreeing with Marx and Engels. Looks like the stupid one here is you, dipshit.
>>

 No.457317

>>457314
Liberalism is about much more than individual rights. While some rights are preserved under liberalism at least on paper in reality the consequences of liberalism are extreme wealth for the few and poverty and derth for the masses.
>>

 No.457318

>>457317
>extreme wealth for the few and poverty and derth for the masses.
As opposed to every system that came before it, which lacked this, am I right? Guess we should go back to slave societies and tribal feudalism, then, since it's all the fucking same.
>>

 No.457319

>>457318
If course not no but firstly: The level of desparity between classes has never been higher in all of recorded history and further more that is the point of Marxism to critique capitalism from a historical narrative and move beyond it as the current state of things via a socialist mode of product.

One is left to conclude only that you are defending this system of accumulation.
>>

 No.457320

>>457319
>If course not no but firstly: The level of desparity between classes has never been higher in all of recorded history
That all depends on how you measure that disparity. If you talk in terms of class mobility, it's certainly lower now than it used to be. There is also that pesky issue of rights, which have their own value outside of the economic one. Of course, we do have examples of extreme disparity in the ancient world, and we certainly have the power to do something with the climate of today. Jeff can't just buy my family, for example, and we could reign him in as was done in the past.
>One is left to conclude only that you are defending this system of accumulation.
Yeah. Against the fucking Taliban. Would you like to live under American liberalism or the Taliban?
>>

 No.457322

>>457320
>>457320
I would rather not live under a capitalist mode of production. Hell at this point I'd rather live under a Chinese government than the US. Whatever socialism will look like in the US it will preserve it's historical characteristics of which rights like the right to speech are preserved, but, the USA fails on nearly every other metric. But I was just saying liberalism as a historical force is much broader than how you describe it.
>>

 No.457327

>>457322
>I would rather not live under a capitalist mode of production. Hell at this point I'd rather live under a Chinese government than the US.
So I assume you're making arrangements to move there, then?
>But I was just saying liberalism as a historical force is much broader than how you describe it.
Of course it is. However, when you boil it down to its essentials, that is what it is about. That is the ideological force behind it.
>>

 No.457328

>>457327
At this point I am not totally unconvinced you are not a wondering polfag. Any socialist worth their own weight knows why that's a dumb thing to say.

>The ideological force behind it

This is pure idealism. The world is not made by ideas. Men do not make their own history under a set of self selected circumstances.
>>

 No.457329

>>457328
I think you're actually retarded. Do you think that the world being material means there are no ideologies? Did socialism come from the material world, or did someone think it up? If not the latter, then can you point me to the physical essence of socialism? Maybe stop being a fucking retard first.
>>

 No.457330

>>457329
I didn't say that but you are insinuating that there is a cohesive collective ideology behind the development and existence of liberalism when there's not. At is "core" liberalism is about the expansion of capitalism and this was true even during loche and the ideological development of liberalism which was born of early mercantile capitalism
>>

 No.457331

What is with this liberal apologist? My life is shit under liberalism it can go fuck itself. If the revolution happens one day I will gladly loot and kill the liberal elite, they'll be hanged and spit on like Mussolini.
>>

 No.457332

>>457330
>I didn't say that but you are insinuating that there is a cohesive collective ideology behind the development and existence of liberalism when there's not.
Do you think there were no liberal political thinkers? Do you think liberalism just happened without any accompanying philosophy?
>liberalism is about the expansion of capitalism
Yes, retard, as a form of eroding the power of aristocracy and establishing individual rights to property. The main driving force was always about individual and inalienable rights.
>>

 No.457333

>>457331
I'm not a liberal apologist, but since we don't have socialism, I would rather have liberalism than the fucking Taliban. Apparently this is a controversial opinion.
>If the revolution happens one day I will gladly loot and kill the liberal elite,
You won't do shit, because you're an edgy teen that couldn't hurt your basic bitch proud boy, and the revolution isn't happening in your lifetime.
>>

 No.457334

I think this site picked up a few socdem reformers or something. I will just self segregate myself because I don't want to interact with them.
>>

 No.457335

>>457333
>I would rather have liberalism than the fucking Taliban. Apparently this is a controversial opinion.
America is just as terrible as the Taliban. But of course I would rather live under western liberalism than the fucking terrorist group.
>You won't do shit, because you're an edgy teen that couldn't hurt your basic bitch proud boy, and the revolution isn't happening in your lifetime.
Why are you so hostile to pro-revolution, why are you even here? You sound exactly like some liberal old dick saying "oh I grew out of my communist phase hahhahah now I vote Liberal". Oh yeah and I bet you're the same guy who just spammed the word tankie to anyone who disagreed with him, I'm actually not a delinquent antifa drop out, I am a pro-revolutionary. Of course the revolution is not guaranteed to happen at all, it most likely wont happen in my fleeting youth, but I will still be against capitalism no matter how hopeless it would be.
>>

 No.457337

>>457335
>America is just as terrible as the Taliban.
Oh, are you sure about that?
> But of course I would rather live under western liberalism than the fucking terrorist group
Oh, so not actually as terrible, then. Look, bro, I'm not saying liberalism is fucking perfect. It's just better than earlier systems, just like socialism will be better than this, and even then, we might find out that socialism has its own contradictions and we need to go even further beyond. I don't know about you, but I'd rather sit here in my expensive ass house that is powered by dead ancient life, two cars, a fucking computer, and a Whataburger sandwich than living under any other system that did not have this as a possible outcome for my life, especially living in the most powerful nation in the world, which means I'm also unlikely to get bombed or invaded.
>Why are you so hostile to pro-revolution,
I'm not hostile to it. You're just young and don't realize that this shit isn't ending any time soon. Capitalism is far from falling apart, and as long as that's true, I'm not going to place my future on some potential revolution, which you specifically are not prepared for. How many years of military service do you have? I would guess zero. Are you fit? Probably not. You're on a fucking imageboard. I have an excuse, at least I'm old and already did those things.
>why are you even here? You sound exactly like some liberal old dick saying "oh I grew out of my communist phase hahhahah now I vote Liberal".
I'm a massive communist, anon, but as long as we're voting, we should probably vote. As long as we're not under socialism, we should probably try to prepare for the future with things like education and retirement for those of use that already have that. Don't fuck your life up under the current system expecting the next. Agitate and educate, but be aware that this is a long-term project.
>Oh yeah and I bet you're the same guy who just spammed the word tankie to anyone who disagreed with him
No. Haven't called anyone that.
>I'm actually not a delinquent antifa drop out, I am a pro-revolutionary. Of course the revolution is not guaranteed to happen at all, it most likely wont happen in my fleeting youth, but I will still be against capitalism no matter how hopeless it would be.
And that's great, but you realize that is a personal issue, right? The original argument was about the Taliban in Afghanistan. I'm glad you agree that life would be better under the US-style liberalism than under the Taliban. Life sucks, but it can and often does suck more.
>>

 No.457344

>>457337
You're right, American is much worse than the Taliban
>>

 No.457345

>>457344
So then you are doing your best to get out of any western-style liberal democracies, right?
>>

 No.457346

>>457337
Youth isn't automatic innocence/idealism. I find that spiteful motivation is more of a thing after thirty.
>>

 No.457347

>>457346
>Youth isn't automatic innocence/idealism
No, but thinking that the revolution is just around the corner is definitely a sign of that. Keep trying for change, and aim high, but remember that things likely won't radically change. Do not fail to plan for your own future while planning for the future of the world. That's really all I'm saying.
>>

 No.457348

>>457345
Let's tabulate the number of deaths caused by the Taliban against the USG in the last 80 years
>>

 No.457351

>>457348
We don't even have to do that, US killed way more. By the way, when are you leaving whatever western democracy you live in now in order to go to your preferred alternative like China, Russia, or yes, even Afghanistan? Clearly, you must be working something out to get the fuck out of whatever American-controlled shithole you live in today.
>>

 No.457352

>>457351
Only rich people can ever dream of leaving their countries of origin.

Legally anwyays
>>

 No.457353

>>457352
Nah. I did it, and I had almost nothing. In fact, I'm pretty sure you can get help if you volunteer your time to your new government. Many of these will be happy to pay your ticket to get there and work for them. What's stopping you?
>>

 No.457355

>>457337
>I'm glad you agree that life would be better under the US-style liberalism than under the Taliban.
You're presenting it disingenuously. The question is: would you rather live under US-style liberalism in the midst of a decades-long war OR under the Taliban in peace time? That is the choice Afghan people were faced, they chose peace. You think they're dumb because you've never been anywhere near a war, for you Americans war is something that happens far away, in third world countries.
>>

 No.457356

>>457355
>>457355
>You're presenting it disingenuously. The question is: would you rather live under US-style liberalism in the midst of a decades-long war OR under the Taliban in peace time?
Well, the Afghans weren't starving under US occupation, nor is it actually peacetime. Afghanistan just switched to a slow-burn insurgency/civil war. What you think the killing stopped just because the US left? I'm sure a lot of women in Afghanistan wish the US had stayed.
>That is the choice Afghan people were faced, they chose peace.
No. The people didn't get a vote. They had a government they had voted into power, which the Biden administration basically sabotaged (though it was a Trump plan).
>You think they're dumb because you've never been anywhere near a war
I've been in two, one willingly and one unwillingly.
>for you Americans war is something that happens far away, in third world countries.
Well, I wasn't born in America, and my home country is still at war. Now, what idpol are you going to pull out next?

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