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/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

"The anons of the past have only shitposted on the Internets about the world, in various ways. The point, however, is to change it."
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File: 1628703860264.jpg ( 286.22 KB , 1136x1600 , KA416860_168.jpg )

 No.439056[Reply][Last 50 Posts]

What is your Leftist unpopular opinion leftypol?

Mine:
>The West is not responsible for every shitty thing that happens in Developing countries, most developing nations just have completely nonfunctional institutions and many suffer from simply having no sense of national identity or cohesion.
>Also "Muh British lines are bad" isn't an excuse, that's practically just arguing that non-ethnostates/Tribal Kingdoms can't work for Africa, South East Asia etc.
291 posts and 28 image replies omitted. Click reply to view.
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 No.464935

>>439152
Im not even a doomer but yeah, being a straight up state capitalist industrialist would be more effective at bringing socialism than being the most hardcore of revolutionaries in the west right now
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 No.464938

>>464935
How?
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 No.464940

>>464938
Retard you literally have to build up the productive forces to even have a base for socialism, industrializing would revitalize the proletariat class as well as advancing the forces of production. Lenin himself said in the NEP that for this reason they should pay attention to the development of Germany and model themselves after it. It’s more of a legitimate path towards socialism than organizing the current “proletariat” which is literally just service workers lmao
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 No.465002

>>439493
You're just a fascist retard.
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 No.465005

>>465002
>My mom is fashist because she won't bring me pizza bites

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 No.464540[Reply]

What if I told you that capitalism being superceded by another mode of production is inevitable, and hence it's only the finer details of culture, politics, and social issues that are actually up for debate.
62 posts and 12 image replies omitted. Click reply to view.
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 No.464972

>>464922
>Yes, when you don't count the unemployed people who are not filing for benefits for one reason or another and you call the people who were forced out of work and into abject poverty by age and the medical conditions that come with it "retired" and not "unemployed" the sampling is indeed wildly inaccurate.
Why would you include people that can't work or are retired into the potential labor pool. You're just talking out of your ass at this point.
U6 accounts for discouraged workers, and once again you're proven wrong because unemployment dipped lower once again this month.
COVID, much like the black plague before it which ushered in capitalism, is creating a new material paradigm.
I don't know what will ultimately happen but even if capitalism survives this it will not be the same neoliberalism.
The death and retirement of 100s of millions of workers has changed every thing. And we haven't even seen the full breadth of China's COVID death and retirement toll.
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 No.464973

>>464972
>much like the black plague before it which ushered in capitalism
The black death pandemic ended before the end of the 14th century, capitalism took a few hundred more years after that to arise.
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 No.464974

>>464973
It destroyed feudal economic relations none the less, paving the way for capitalism.
The golden era of the labor movement came right after WWII for the same reasons, mass deaths of proles. Neoliberalism's refusal to enact a comprehensive welfare state to stop the pandemic is having the same effect.
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 No.464975

>>464974
>The golden era of the labor movement came right after WWII for the same reasons
In which country? This certainly wasn't true in the United States, the golden era of organized labor was before WWII. After the war a massive crackdown on leftist union organizers ensued, the Taft-Hartley act was passed, and the remaining union organizers made a Faustian bargain with the Democrats that destroyed their own ability to organize.
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 No.464983

>>464975
You uyghhers fight over the most retarded and mundane shit

File: 1675501078346-0.jpg ( 62.25 KB , 388x278 , organ capitalism.jpg )

File: 1675501078346-1.png ( 129.64 KB , 938x2384 , prison-harvest.png )

 No.464981[Reply]

The privatized prison complex in the US now appears to be considering going into organ trafficking.

In this scheme the police hunts poor people, then the prison extract organs from them in exchange for their early release.

When future revolutionaries overthrow this system, they will have done nothing wrong.

File: 1675291302623.jpg ( 12 KB , 800x534 , Flag-Taiwan.jpg )

 No.464892[Reply]

If socialism is anti-imperialism, why do some of you support the dismantling and reunification of a free, democratic republic such as Taiwan?
17 posts and 2 image replies omitted. Click reply to view.
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 No.464957

>>464939
><the significant role agents of the American government and official media had played in fomenting unrest in Hong Kong
Of course, he didn't say that. You're quoting an article that never has him saying that. Good job, though.
>They basically confessed to it, so don't bother with denial.
Well, he didn't confess to that. He says protesters use US-made tools. That's as much of involvement as me using Chinese-made electronics to protest in the US. If you're going to go for media involvement, then certainly any and all Chinese-funded media in the US can also be said to be involvement. Does that mean the Chinese are the ones causing protests?

>>464942
>N-No
Yea, because you can't. It's always the same with you China simps.
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 No.464962

>>464957
No your just willing to simp for the status quo and won’t look at things critically
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 No.464968

>>464962
No. I just don't like dictatorships. It's not that hard to understand.
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 No.464969

>>464968
Nice b8
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 No.464970

>>464969
>not liking dictatorships is b8
Okay.

File: 1675424013984.jpg ( 82.11 KB , 525x550 , cloud capital means of beh….jpg )

 No.464944[Reply]

Yanis Varoufakis went to Cuba and gave a speech about a new non-alignment movement.
https://invidious.snopyta.org/watch?v=6MfuGSlDRsc

He brought up a newto me concept of cloud-capital as a means of behavioral modification.
He said we should differentiate it to means of production.
(He speaks about this at 18:00 minutes)

Is he right about this ?

Should we add the new category of
<means of behavioral modification
to Marxist theory ?

he also says that
<who controls cloud capital controls surplus value
Post too long. Click here to view the full text.
3 posts omitted. Click reply to view.
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 No.464952

>>464950
change for the sake of change is retarded

classical analysis applies as long as there is a large group of people whose only means of sustenance is selling of labor power

especially when cloud fits the classical definition of MoP better than many other capital goods
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 No.464953

>>464948
>MoP are production goods that are "worked collectively, owned individually"
>Cloud shit fits into this category like a glove

>>464950
>lack of victories for the left might indicate a need for change

I think both of these statements are true.
But i still don't know what to think about this.

The thing about taking over "cloud shit", i don't particularly like it from a technical perspective.
All those data-centers that run the cloud, function like some kind of brain for high tech society. They look really vulnerable to me, because there has been a consolidation underway. From millions of small on site-IT to about a 1000 mega data centers. It doesn't take much to destroy a 1000 large buildings filled with server racks and then the hole system grinds to a halt.

I would rather it was physically dispersed, at least then you don't have to worry about protecting a few high value targets. It comes with the downside that it's easier to gain physical access to dispersed computer hardware, concentrated IT can have really tight physical security. But on balance, i believe it is easier to compensate for un-authorized hardware access.
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 No.464954

>>464953
>The thing about taking over "cloud shit", i don't particularly like it from a technical perspective.
lol, for me it's the other way around
it's beautiful from a technical perspective, very agile
running your own server was never that easy

computer systems have come full circle - only on a bigger, global scale now

>All those data-centers that run the cloud, function like some kind of brain for high tech society.
lol, yea, and rail system is like veins of this high tech "organism"

It's just infrastructure
Pull your head out of your ass

>They look really vulnerable to me, because there has been a consolidation underway.
Post too long. Click here to view the full text.
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 No.464958

>>464954
>very agile
Oh no you did a corporate speak. Please pivot to normal speak.

I agree with you that the cloud stuff is very convenient, but there is no reason that physically distributed hardware could not have the same level of abstraction and ease of use.

The thing with cargo and power grids there isn't really an option to spread it out, but for Servers, you don't have to densely pack all the server racks in a few spots. It might even have some benefits for cooling to spread it out.

Only super-computers need to have all their hardware smooshed all in one spot.

You do not need a nuke to break a big building full of servers. Medium military grade weapons can damage the power and cooling for a data center and put it out of commission for a month.
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 No.464964

>>464952
Cool story. Has that helped you at all

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 No.464928[Reply]

For one, I believe that it is very based for prisoners to be working in chicken factories and making bricks. This is forced labor in my opinion, but instead of free people doing these menial jobs, the prisoners do it as punishment. This stimulates more production.

Secondly, I read the bit from Cockshott where he states that cheap labor doesn't bring about automation as fast, I agree. I have noticed that when I watch factory videos, there are many, many jobs that could be automated but aren't. Anyhow, I would like that problem to be solved because my goals are the same as yours: A healthy, happy, clean world. I also agree with labor unions most of the time. I am genuinely interested in socialism, although it seems flawed in the sense that it reduces personal responsibility to the point where workers just don't care.

Thirdly, I would like to ask something about you guys as I have my own views on economics, I don't subscribe to a political philosophy, but I am economically right, socially left, how do we (according to you) overcome the lack of variety that former socialist countries had?

Fourthly, please don't be mean, I am just interested, and no I won't read Marx, it's too boring.
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 No.464932

>>464928
>I believe that it is very based for prisoners to be working in chicken factories and making bricks. This is forced labor in my opinion, but instead of free people doing these menial jobs, the prisoners do it as punishment.

As long as you pay the prisoners the same wage as a normal worker, it might be worth considering under certain circumstances. But you have to pay attention that you are not creating a perverse system that has an incentive to imprison more people because the prison factory has a labor shortage.
<PA system crackles:
<Attention fellow citizens for the next two months littering carries a 20 year prison sentence, and in unrelated news the protectorate announces that boneless chicken wings will become available again in short order.
I don't know exactly where the threshold should be, i haven't studied this, but my guess is that the prison population should not be above 0.5% of the overall population, probably 0,3% would be better.

>Secondly, I read the bit from Cockshott where he states that cheap labor doesn't bring about automation as fast, I agree. I have noticed that when I watch factory videos, there are many, many jobs that could be automated but aren't.
A socialist system could just instruct factories to automate by decree, and that would work to a certain degree, but it would use up a lot of political energy to enforce it. It's easier to just make labor-power expensive enough so that increasing labor productivity through technological automation is baked into the economic incentive structures.

>I am genuinely interested in socialism, although it seems flawed in the sense that it reduces personal responsibility to the point where workers just don't care.
Socialists tend to have an instrumentalist view on this, as long as systems work and people live good lives it doesn't really matter. I can tell you that capitalist methods are entirely ineffective, negative reinforcement only results in apathy. And i think it's not supposed to work, invoking "personal responsibility" is only an excuse for punishment and neglect.

If you are genuinely interested in figuring out how to build a social environment that fosters persoPost too long. Click here to view the full text.
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 No.464933

>>464932
holy based

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 No.464685[Reply]

The standard Marxist definition of fascism comes from Georgi Dimitrov writings The class character of fascism, and he defines it as:
<The open terrorist dictatorship of the most reactionary, most chauvinistic and most imperialist elements of finance capital.

source
https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/dimitrov/works/1935/08_02.htm#s2

But somehow today there is a lot of effort being put into redefine fascism into something else.
Even some Marxist spaces often can't properly define the class character of fascism.

Why is that ?
38 posts and 6 image replies omitted. Click reply to view.
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 No.464815

>>464808
Given that leaders of the Nazi movement were given private industrial operations to manage separate from their job as a governmental official, clearly there's a difference.
And that the State very often came in and created deals and developments between competing private companies for the ends of the greater whole, shows a difference. When the Nazi party wanted a new machine gun for their military, they forced a bunch of different companies together to pool their patents and knowledge and work to spit out unified designs, leaving you at the end with the MG34. After which the State worked out large scale payment plans, so that everyone with a patent involved in the design got paid out.

Both are significantly different than the arrangement found in China today or in the past.
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 No.464818

>>464814
holy shit bro
do you expect anyone to read all that shit
I'm on a 4K TV and that shit still takes up a whole screen what the fuck
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 No.464821

>>464818
>i have a fancy screen and i can't read.
You can download the ghost of Stephen Hawking and he'll read it to you, like an audio-book-player that is trapped in a steel-drum.
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 No.464822

>>464821
Brevity is the soul of wit.
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 No.464831

>>464793
>a plain definition of fascism makes you offended on china's behalf
big tell
>>464796
bot post

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 No.464798[Reply]

They accomplished so little and somehow all ended up as functionaries of the bourgeois state. Why is this?

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 No.464691[Reply]

>what new year's resolutions should the left make?
Comrades. The year of the rabbit (or cat) is here. What are some resolutions or changes the left ought to make to usher in a glorious, prosperous, and harmonious socialism?
2 posts and 2 image replies omitted. Click reply to view.
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 No.464716

>>464702
Bee and Junko are pretty cute, actually. Leftypol always attracts cute ones.
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 No.464717

>>464716
How do you know they're cute if we haven't seen them? In fact there's a decent chance that they're men.
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 No.464718

>>464717
There have been leaks of their faces. Bee accidentally took a picture and revealed her face and body somewhat in the reflection of a glass while she was drunk.

I am pretty sure junko has done some cos-playing or some shit. I know her face has been leaked too.
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 No.464719

>>464718
I remember the Bee leak but I haven't heard about junko's. Post it if you have it anon, I want to see what leftypol's IDF babe looks like.
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 No.464790

>>464691
my resolution is to get my computer shit sorted out so i can start drafting my notes into theory

File: 1669869386272.jpg ( 89.28 KB , 680x680 , FSfXGSYVUAA57UA.jpg )

 No.461546[Reply]

>What are the political implications of the pareto principle both in the left and in the wider world.
Does fact that 80% of impact/results stem from 20% of agents explain the inherent inequality of the world. Is this necessarily a bad thing, or is it just a thing that is devoid of value but should simply be accounted for?
17 posts and 2 image replies omitted. Click reply to view.
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 No.461883

>>461546
If the pareto principle was true, it does not allow for any optimization, because it would be an emergent property of a system.
In other words if you were to eliminate the less impactful 80% of the agents, it would follow that 80% of the remaining agents would have 4% of the former impact and total impact would decrease by 80%.
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 No.461884

File: 1670583208077.jpg ( 88.08 KB , 640x751 , 1670582721746318.jpg )

meesa think pareetoo is pseudoo sciency stuff
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 No.464770

File: 1675062611749.jpg ( 59.09 KB , 828x727 , 1675032436503845.jpg )

Even women can't escape it…
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 No.464771

>>461884
>meesa think pareetoo is pseudoo sciency stuff
That is true, but that doesn't stop the pseuds from pushing it.
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 No.464775

>>464771
Are you one of the 20% of visitors responsible for 80% of posts here?

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