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Chess Anonymous 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:18:49 No.3291

I'm making this thread here, because the other boards are practically dead. If a mod chooses to move it to /hobby/, that's cool, I just wanted some exposure on /leftypol/.

As you might now, chess played a large role in the Soviet Union. They outright dominated the game for decades and it was commonly played ever since the inception of the union.

I think chess does possess the potential to develop and train the strategic thinking skills of players, if they abstract from the game and attempt to apply it to the real world.

But it's also a fun game. Because of that I made a /leftypol/ club on chess.com, which is a great website with a nice UI and plenty of resources to learn and improve at chess. I've been using it for months now and got far better at chess and I even do the puzzles on it for fun every day. The way the website is designed makes learning chess and improving really, really easy. Making an account is free and would be quick. I know this sounded like an ad, lol.

So, I'm inviting you comrades to start learning chess or improve whatever skill level you are at and join the /leftypol/ chess club. We could play against each other. Perhaps even organize tournaments. I think it would be really cool if we could get something like this going and make it the community wide hobby. If only 3 people join that would be good enough honestly.

[b]Link[/b]
https://www.chess.com/club/leftypol

Anonymous 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:18:49 No.3292

definitely belongs to hobby, never been that good at it, but really would like to get into it.

Anonymous 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:18:49 No.3293

>>3292
Yeah, I can recommend the site for that. They have chronologically ordered lessons with videos and related tests to make you apply what you've just watched. They also give you statistical feedback to everything. I'm currently at 'Winning with tactics'.

Anonymous 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:18:50 No.3294

File: 1608527929977.jpg (614.8 KB, 1137x1101, FloorGoban.JPG)

Oh you mean go for dumb people? :^)

but really chess is pretty fun

Anonymous 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:18:50 No.3295

File: 1608527930152.png (24.3 KB, 602x508, img.png)

I think memorization board games like chess and go are a total waste of time. AI made it completely meaningless.

https://www.theverge.com/2019/11/27/20985260/ai-go-alphago-lee-se-dol-retired-deepmind-defeat

Anonymous 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:18:50 No.3296

>>3291
>I think chess does possess the potential to develop and train the strategic thinking skills of players
Chess was a big meme for decades in computer science, but what has come out of that aside from programs that are good at Chess? There was a lot speculation that coming up with programs that are good at Chess would somehow help with coming up with programs that are good at solving other problems. But can you give a single example for that? (In the USSR Mikhail Botvinnik shilled for that real-world connection and had nothing to show in the end.)
>>3294
People who are relly good at Chess who start playing Go are much better at it right from the start than other noobs for some reason, even though in terms of programming a player it's extremely different from Chess.
>>3295
Do bikes and cars make running competitions meaningless? Besides, there is the issue that some AIs are basically a black box even to the programmer, so that it's a mystery to explain how it makes its decisions. (At least for picture classification there is an approach that generates a heatmap picture that tells you which pixels in the original were regarded by the AI as strongly supporting the classification it chose in the end. For example, a picture with a train might show that the AI heavily relied on the rails and not the actual train to make the right call.)

Anonymous 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:18:50 No.3297

>>3296
>But can you give a single example for that?
They are programs for solving chess solely. Human beings can abstract and generalize.

Anonymous 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:18:50 No.3298

how do I know whether I'm too retarded for chess? every time I try to learn I don't see any improvement and 99% of my moves are just blunders.

Anonymous 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:18:50 No.3299

>>3298
in my university i had a chess trainer or however you call it. it is another way to learn to play chess

Anonymous 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:18:50 No.3300

>>3297
Of course I didn't mean to poopoo on Chess programs for only being able to play Chess. That's not my criterion for judging the Computer-Chess hype as mistaken. The criterion is that the humans tackling Computer-Chess issues haven't learned insights transferable to other domains like economic planning. Botvinnik wrote a confused book where he repeatedly chanted that they were strong similarities between these topics, but it was just vague gestures. I suspect he wanted resources because of his interest as a Chess nerd. You know what would have been a killer argument? Coming up with rules for translating a scheduling problem into a Chess puzzle, so that a good player solving it has something that can be easily translated back to get a solution in the real world. But no translation recipe for something like that has been found.

Anonymous 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:18:51 No.3301

>>3300
Hm, yeah you have a point. How much does being good at chess translate to understanding real life battle strategies better though?

Anonymous 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:18:51 No.3302

>>3294
I fucking love go. I wish I had time to play it. I mostly just do tsumego on my phone when I have a few free minutes.

I suggest everyone try it out. It's more complex and, I think, a much more interesting game than chess. The best place for English speaking beginners is OGS. It even has a tutorial teaching you the basics and a bunch of puzzles to learn. It's easiest to start on a 9x9 board, but you can do 13x13 or just start on the full 19x19 board if you want.

Here are some links for anyone interested:
This a western server good for beginners. It's in a browser so it's convenient.
https://online-go.com/

This is a Japanese server and it requires a client download.
https://pandanet-igs.com/communities/pandanet

This is a Chinese server and it also requires a client download. I think one of the download links on the site includes a bunch of bloat or something. I use it the most, but the client is in Chinese and kind of hard to navigate.
https://www.foxwq.com/

This is the Korean server. Yet another client you have to download.
http://www.tygembaduk.com/

The Korean and Chinese servers have the most people. Chinese and Korean servers are also known for having a more aggressive and fast play style in general. I believe all the servers have phone apps, but they are pretty buggy in my experience.

Anonymous 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:18:51 No.3303

I will move this thread later today to /games/ (which includes the discussion of all types of games not only video games).
I think I will add the link to the /leftypol/ sticky if the rest of the mod team is OK with it.

Anonymous 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:18:51 No.3304

>>3301
Not him, but I think Chess can teach you a good number "lessons" generally applicable to real life.

How to think ahead, to make moves in anticipation for something much further down the road, to form your plans around what the enemy is doing or what you predict they're trying to do, to "think several moves ahead" based on cause and effect actions and reactions, to not get tunnel vision and focus entirely on one piece or area, but to consider the whole board, to alter your strategy to a changing situation, etc.

Anonymous 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:18:51 No.3305

>>3304
I don't think people will generally learn these skill from playing chess, at least not to any great degree. Rather, I think, people with these skills are drawn towards these types of games.

Anonymous 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:18:51 No.3306

>>3303
> I will add the link to the /leftypol/ sticky if the rest of the mod team is OK with it.
That would be really cool, thanks. I‘d love to do tournaments among users.

Anonymous 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:18:51 No.3307

>>3302
>This is a Japanese server and it requires a client download.
>https://pandanet-igs.com/communities/pandanet
The android client is quite good
Also recommend crazystone

Anonymous 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:18:51 No.3308

>>3305
These are skills you have to learn to get any good at these games.

Comrade 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:18:52 No.3311

>>3291
Chess and war are completely different. For instance, a war is never one vs one. There is always multiple games going on, with a lot of different group of interests. There will be infighting in every camp, there will be traitors and sabotage.

Comrade 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:18:52 No.3314

Chess is TRASH.

1. A lot of it is memorization. If you don't memorize the 20 different openings and standard counters you are automatically at a disadvantage. Don't give me that shit about "figuring it out yourself" it is mandatory to memorize this crap if you want to be even AVERAGE, let alone actually good at the game.

2. White's first turn advantage is retarded and the fact that no one can think of a way to balance the game after centuries is stupid.

3. It has literally zero relevance to strategy, tactics, and war. Its reputation as a trainer of generals and smart men is completely unearned and undeserved.

FUCK CHESS.

Comrade 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:18:53 No.3318

>>3314
That's why there's Fischer random chess. It's much more fun than regular chess imo.

It generally trains you in confrontations to rely on strategy instead of deception (like Poker), which is a good skill to have for any leftist.

Comrade 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:18:53 No.3320

>>3301
I strongly doubt that there is much of such an effect. Chess is too removed from reality, and this distance doesn't just come from abstraction, Chess is just weird. The terrain is flat and without any features, the rules of movement on this flat surface are bizarre, you can only move one of your units during your turn, and you kill by touching each other. I believe it makes more sense to play the war games of the 19th century Prussian army or a modern mutation of that.

>>3314
1. I agree with >>3318 on that. Bobby Fischer came up with a variant where you get a randomized starting configuration (same for both players).
2. There is a general method for balancing games that have a first-turn advantage: After the first player moves, the second player can decide to switch places with the first player or continue playing like normally. Try both 1 and 2 together and see if you like it.
3. I'm 99.9 % with you on that point.

Comrade 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:18:53 No.3321

>>3314
I don't know much about war or chess, but Mao made comparisons between go(weiqi/weichi) and encirclement in On Protracted War. I've heard people say he and his generals played a lot of go, but I haven't actually seen a source on that.

If any games are helpful it would be some kind of war games modeled on the real thing.

Comrade 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:24:02 No.5959

>>3314
All true but it's still fun to play

Comrade 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:24:02 No.5960

>>3291
>chess.com
>not the superior and open-source lichess.org

Comrade 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:24:02 No.5961

>>5960
Cool, thanks for letting me know about this.

Comrade 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:24:03 No.5965

>>3318
Deception is handy tbh.

Comrade 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:24:03 No.5966

>>3302

Bro i tried learning go today and i played a game online with a 5x5 board.

I lost by 36 points with territory scoring. How tf does that work? I’m so confused on the scoring, I had about as many pieces.

Played on here fyi: https://www.cosumi.net/en/

Comrade 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:24:04 No.5977

>>5966
Go scoring is the territory you have surrounded with your stones + captures, iirc depending on the scoring system (Japanese or Chinese) adding unnecessary stones inside your own territory will actually lower your score

Comrade 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:24:04 No.5980

>>5977

God I cant figure out this territory scoring. It’s either a retarded system or I’m retarded, but I’m frustrated so I’m going to say territory scoring is retarded. Why can’t I just play old go rules online with just the pieces?

I have a 5x5 matrix with 25 vertices and yet somehow I lose by 36 points. I thought the max would be 25 since its all the freaking territory. Then on top of that it looks like I captured some territory and the stupid AI just marks all my pieces as dead and I lose the game. Why does this game have such annoying rules?

Comrade 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:24:04 No.5982

>>5980
lmao how can you lose by 36 points on a 5x5 board, is it giving a retarded amount of komi to white? Can you post a screenshot? I'm curious.

Comrade 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:24:05 No.5985

>>3314
>2. White's first turn advantage is retarded and the fact that no one can think of a way to balance the game after centuries is stupid.

You're supposed to play 2+ rounds dummkopf.

Comrade 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:24:05 No.5986

>>5985
Also at amateur level it doesn't really matter. I actually prefer playing as black since you are the one that dictates the opening

Comrade 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:24:05 No.5992

>>5982

I have no idea what the ai is doing to calculate the score. It’s saying I lost by 25 points on this game, how come I have territory at the top wtf?

https://www.cosumi.net/en/replay/?b=You&w=COSUMI&k=0&r=w25&bs=5&gr=bdccdbdcbbbcddcdcbabceadecbeaadeacebeaedtttt&ds=aaeabbcbdbacec&bm=acc

Comrade 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:24:06 No.5993

File: 1608528246144.jpg (424.93 KB, 651x958, Image 11.jpg)

>>5992

update this game is retarded. There is no clear way to determine whose territory is what it seems arbitrary as fuck. Someone explain to me how "neutral" territory is even determined and why it didn't consider my pieces to surround the entire left side.

Comrade 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:24:06 No.5998

>>5993
Maybe you should actually read the rules?

Comrade 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:24:06 No.6002

>>5993
you can't just draw a line down the board and claim one side lol

Comrade 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:24:07 No.6004

>>5993
You lost by more than that
Black can't make life

Comrade 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:24:08 No.6009

>>5993
you should learn about alive and dead groups: https://www.learn-go.net/

Comrade 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:24:08 No.6010

>>6009
to expand you have no space for eyes both of your groups are incredibly dead

Comrade 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:24:08 No.6011

>>5993
you tried to play connect four lmaooo 🤣

Comrade 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:24:11 No.6027

>>3314
>>3321
Honestly it sounds like a correlation = causation fallacy. Smarter people perform better in aspects of strategy, so it makes sense that a genius on the battlefield would have problem solving skills that transfer over into other aspects of life. I bet great war generals would have been better at, say, magic the gathering than average joe.

Comrade 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:24:12 No.6034

>>3321
I think that's just some cool Chinese aesthetic - Go has also been used by the Chinese to describe their Maritime policies in SEA. I wouldn't look too much into it.

Comrade 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:24:15 No.6055

https://www.mdpi.com/2409-9287/5/4/37/htm
Go not chess but may as well keep this thread active and bumped

Comrade 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:24:18 No.6076

>>6055
Cool article, thanks for the poast!

Comrade 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:24:19 No.6079

Why are Gofags so incredibly insecure about Chess?

Comrade 2020-12-21 (Mon) 05:26:10 No.7048

https://aeon.co/essays/playing-chess-is-an-essential-life-lesson-in-concentration

https://www.mdpi.com/2409-9287/5/4/37/htm

Anonymous 2021-01-09 (Sat) 08:40:05 No.7205

File: 1610181605600.jpg (151.22 KB, 1024x768, class-struggle-board-game.jpg)

>>3291

Oldish post, but I just Dl Alexander Kotov and Mikhail Yudovich's "Soviet School of Chess", its from 1961 so its a bit dated but it goes through all of the Soviet Grand masters and a lot of material. I'm just working through the first games from earlier Tsarizt era players, so they're building more of the national history for how the bolshevik culture changed the game. The American publisher had to preface it with a mccarthyite set of smears on " Communist propaganda", all of it easily refutable, and kind of funny in a quaint sort of cliche manner. I just learned chess notation, so i'm getting back into the swing of things, but I would like to play one of these days with your group. I could care less about AI programming, the games flaws, or whether it is a game for master tacticians, it's fun, I miss playing it with friends at cafes, and It's one line of strategic thought amongst many, its general lessons are clearly applicable to politics and class struggle, and obviously playing it does not make one a Vo Nguyen Giap. Its still fun though!!!

Anonymous 2021-01-13 (Wed) 13:40:59 No.7232

Is the group at chess.com still alive, what with the split and all? I'm a nooboid looking to get into the game in a somewhat more serious fashion and chess.com seems to be a good starting point.

>>7205
Looks like a fascinating book catch with a hilarious (and historically interesting) preface, gz. However, you surely mean 'could not care less'. :^)

Anonymous 2021-02-05 (Fri) 07:05:38 No.7531

>>3298
you just need to pay attention to what youre doing wrong. think in terms of what each of their pieces can do at any time and what your pieces can do at any time, and have a few contingency plans for each possible move of theirs. be aggressive but dont stick to one overall strategy

Anonymous 2021-02-22 (Mon) 07:33:08 No.7768

https://www.news18.com/news/buzz/youtube-ai-blocked-chess-channel-after-confusing-black-and-white-for-racist-slurs-3454316.html

Anonymous 2021-03-14 (Sun) 03:47:19 No.8165

>>3296
Computers aren't capable of abstract or conceptual thought. Figuring out how to make AI that can play chess proficiently is probably good excercise in problem solving, but is obviously going to run into diminishing returns.

Anonymous 2021-03-16 (Tue) 15:08:37 No.8231

File: 1615907314133.pdf (10.63 MB, 201x300, (The Soviet Chess Primer) ….pdf)

Became interested in Chess recently but i'm still absolute shit. Been trying to work my way through this book, figured I'd upload it for any anons who may want to check it out.

Anonymous 2021-03-18 (Thu) 00:46:38 No.8253

File: 1616028398731.jpg (149.25 KB, 400x400, Petrov.jpg)

>>8231
Do you have an opening you like yet?

Anonymous 2021-03-18 (Thu) 17:29:42 No.8289

Was there ever smth like a /leftypol/ chess tournament?

Anonymous 2021-03-18 (Thu) 18:28:52 No.8298

>>5960
based post anon
i made a chess.com account just to join OP's club, but yeah this should be on lichess

Anonymous 2021-03-18 (Thu) 18:30:31 No.8299

>>8298
lichess has better puzzles tbh

Anonymous 2021-03-18 (Thu) 18:31:51 No.8300

I haven't played chess in ages and I only ever learned how to move the pieces but I would gladly join you guys, that'd be useful for learning too

Anonymous 2021-03-18 (Thu) 18:34:34 No.8302

File: 1616092474747.jpg (63.04 KB, 380x380, middle-puzzle-1.jpg)

>>8300
Puzzles are the way to go
White to move

Anonymous 2021-03-18 (Thu) 18:44:17 No.8304

File: 1616093057366.jpg (36.31 KB, 340x500, 9780394737577-us.jpg)

Anonymous 2021-03-18 (Thu) 19:11:15 No.8311

>>8304
Blacks last move was stalemate
Kd8d7 Kb7a8
Kd7c8 stalemate

Anonymous 2021-03-18 (Thu) 19:17:50 No.8312

>>8311
puzzle says "black moved last" – i swear there's a valid solution to this puzzle that meets that requirement, even if it seems impossible at first

Anonymous 2021-03-18 (Thu) 19:23:55 No.8313

File: 1616095435108.jpg (163.51 KB, 1080x539, Screenshot_20210318-142312….jpg)

>>8312
lame gay and stupid

Anonymous 2021-03-18 (Thu) 19:32:21 No.8314

>>8313
sry 2 hear ur inability to engage in retrograde analysis makes u feel so insecure that u invoke homosexuality as an insult directed at based logic puzzles, anon

Anonymous 2021-03-19 (Fri) 01:56:52 No.8322

>>8302
Ng5f7+ Kh7
Nf3g5#

Fischer bros, what went wrong? Anonymous 2021-03-19 (Fri) 02:19:16 No.8323

File: 1616120353387-0.jpg (196.58 KB, 1140x797, Fischer-Spassky-Chess-Boar….jpg)

File: 1616120353387-1.pdf (244.67 KB, 67x118, spassky-fischer-11th-match….pdf)

File: 1616120353387-2.jpg (161.56 KB, 1080x1288, 1972 Spatssy vs Fischer ga….jpg)

August 6. 1972 World Chess Championship
USSR vs USA
This game was a dramatic #win# for Spassky, his first since games 1 and 2. As in game 7, Fischer essayed his favorite Poisoned Pawn Variation (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poisoned_Pawn_Variation); Spassky surprised him with the startling 14.Nb1 (given !! by many annotators at the time), retreating the knight to its starting position.
Although later analysis showed that the move was only sufficient for equality if Black responded correctly, Fischer did not. If 15…Ne7!? by Black then 16.N1d2!? and the game is unclear (Gipslis). After inferior defense by Fischer, Spassky trapped Fischer's queen and handed him his only defeat ever as Black in the Poisoned Pawn.

1.e4 c5
2.Nf3 d6
3.d4 cxd4
4.Nxd4 Nf6
5.Nc3 a6
6.Bg5 e6
7.f4 Qb6
8.Qd2 Qxb2
9.Nb3 Qa3
10.Bxf6 gxf6
11.Be2 h5
12.0-0 Nc6
13.Kh1 Bd7
14.Nb1!! Qb4
15.Qe3 d5
16.exd5 Ne7
17.c4 Nf5
18.Qd3 h4
19.Bg4 Nd6
20.N1d2 f5
21.a3 Qb6
22.c5 Qb5
23.Qc3 fxg4
24.a4 h3
25.axb5 hxg2+
26.Kxg2 Rh3
27.Qf6 Nf5
28.c6 Bc8
29.dxe6 fxe6
30.Rfe1 Be7
31.Rxe6 resign

Anonymous 2021-04-02 (Fri) 09:17:55 No.8474

https://www.eapoe.org/works/essays/maelzel.htm

OP 2021-04-02 (Fri) 12:44:41 No.8475

In case anyone is still checking on this thread, I'd like to have you actively play matches with each other. Let's get this club going! Currently I have exams until the 8th of April, but I will join you then.

Anonymous 2021-04-02 (Fri) 13:28:20 No.8477

>>8475
I'd join but I only play on lichess.

Anonymous 2021-04-02 (Fri) 14:54:10 No.8479

>>8477
Stop being a cunt

Anonymous 2021-04-05 (Mon) 15:56:59 No.8560

>>8477
>>8479
I‘m sorry. I had too much caffeine that day and it put me on the EDGE.

Anonymous 2021-04-06 (Tue) 11:10:26 No.8579

>>8299
lichess has better everything

Anonymous 2021-04-06 (Tue) 11:38:41 No.8580

>>8477
I made a lichess group: https://lichess.org/team/leftypol

Anonymous 2021-04-06 (Tue) 16:02:31 No.8582

>>8580
Nice how does thjs work?

Anonymous 2021-05-18 (Tue) 04:09:42 No.9163

https://www.chess.com/article/view/10-positions-chess-engines-just-dont-understand

Anonymous 2021-05-18 (Tue) 04:47:45 No.9164

>>9163
Neat article, thanks anon.

Anonymous 2021-05-18 (Tue) 12:05:50 No.9168

File: 1621339550332.png (66.55 KB, 1107x694, ClipboardImage.png)

>>9163
this is another cool position engines won't understand. Stockfish will evaluate it at -6 despite being an obvious draw to a human that realizes that black has no way of making progress.

https://lichess.org/analysis/standard/q7/8/2p5/3p2pp/6pk/4B1p1/6P1/7K_w_-_-_0_1#0

Anonymous 2021-05-18 (Tue) 12:42:03 No.9169

>>9168
I suck at chess and I realized it :D

Anonymous 2021-06-05 (Sat) 20:50:20 No.9786

>>9169
Deutscher detektiert

Anonymous 2021-06-27 (Sun) 04:04:44 No.10405

https://github.com/karayaman/Play-online-chess-with-real-chess-board

Anonymous 2021-06-29 (Tue) 08:50:53 No.10494

>>10405
cool project

Anonymous 2021-06-30 (Wed) 16:41:40 No.10548

>>9168
Can't Queen just A1+, bishop has to block G1, Queen sac and the d and c pawns can progress forward?

Anonymous 2021-06-30 (Wed) 16:42:30 No.10549

>>10548
Never mind, the pawns won't be able to reach no?

Anonymous 2021-06-30 (Wed) 17:29:20 No.10551

File: 1625074160809.png (29.28 KB, 680x682, ClipboardImage.png)

>>10548
after you sack the black king is stuck and it's effectively out of the game and the white king is in the square so he can reach before they promote

Anonymous 2021-06-30 (Wed) 17:31:38 No.10552

>>10548
btw if you click on the lichess link you can try to play it out :)
https://lichess.org/analysis/standard/q7/8/2p5/3p2pp/6pk/4B1p1/6P1/7K_w_-_-_0_1#0

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