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File: 1705170512636.png ( 353.66 KB , 680x373 , socialist_albania_meme.png )

 No.7479

In Socialist Albania:

Increased life expectancy 11 months every year

First country in the world to achieve complete electrification

Death rate 37% lower than European average

Quadrupled doctors per capita in 18 years

Population growth 3.5 times higher than European average

(Further reading: https://etheses.lse.ac.uk/2870/1/U615819.pdf)
>>

 No.7480

image fit for crickets
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 No.7481

File: 1705424284195.jpg ( 17.17 KB , 450x370 , huh.jpg )

>Collapses
Huh? Again? How did that happen?

<b-b-b-b-but whataboutism!
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 No.7482

File: 1705425321165.gif ( 1.48 MB , 498x490 , patrick-bateman.gif )

Seriously, it always makes me smile how all of the post ww2 communist affiliated soycieties collapsed almost by the same blueprint even if they were at each others throats.

It's almost as if they had some common sociopolitical characteristics and systemic issues, huh?

nah, that doesn't make any sense, that's not what my supreme gentleman general secretary have said!
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 No.7483

File: 1705428221592.gif ( 3.49 MB , 498x270 , nicholas.gif )

>something something when I look at the brave mujahedin resisting Soviet social-imperialist aggression my thoughts go back to how our party was valiantly resisting fascist aggression in the mountains of Albania
these are supposedly our Greatest Fuhrers lol

>m-m-m-muh horseahoe strawman!!1

sorry, "the most advanced section of the working class", but it was our Greatest Genius Hoxha (and Mao) who first compared soyviets to the fascists, kek

tho there is a grain of truth in this conclusion, as the left tyranny has some common characteristics with the right tyranny (they are both tyranny, duh), tho the self-consciousness is hilariously lacking
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 No.7484

File: 1705429626720.jpeg ( 36.8 KB , 474x474 , genius.jpeg )

>>7482
tho I'm being unfair to our marxist-leninist comrades here

they have obviously meticulously ANALyzed the past experiences (using modern advanced state-of-the-art dialectical algorithms) and as a result achieved a theoretical-strategic BREAKTHROUGH: "Just install Monarchy Principate, Bro!"
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 No.7485

File: 1705429969448.jpeg ( 42.06 KB , 390x470 , lol.jpeg )

man, I'm on fire today, laughing my ass off at my own jokes kek

another day - another leftoid BTFOd
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 No.7486

>>7479
>muh growth stats
It's not hard to double your growth from 0.00001% to 0.00002%, this is how to lie with statistics 101. The fact that albania still hasn't caught up with western europe is proof your growth was never sustainable or indeed real in the first place.
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 No.7488

File: 1705431961386.gif ( 852.82 KB , 220x209 , what-a-story-marx.gif )

oh and yes, this >>7486 anon is right, growth stats from the low level are only good for populist propaganda

room temperature autism score leftoids think they can sustain exponential growth rates because.. *checks notes* communism would UNLEASH forces of production something something

well, I sure would love to UNLEASH (lol) my forces of reproduction in gommunism if you know what I mean
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 No.7489

>>7488
To be honest I've never seen marxists bring up post ww2 balkans before it is usually a natsoc/fascist talking point. But yes basically, without the evil (capitalists|jews) stealing the surplus value from the (workers|aryans) then magic prosperity happens. And when the magic prosperity doesn't happen it's because they didn't exterminate the (wreckers|parasites) hard enough.
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 No.7490

>>7481
>Soviet Collapse
>how did that happen?
The topic was about the superior social outcomes in the Soviet Union.

The Soviet dissolution is a different topic but here's a good materialist analysis none the less.
https://farside.link/invidious/watch?v=EE-kCZnlGZU
>>

 No.7491

>>7482
>Seriously, it always makes me smile
The effects of the Soviet dissolution were disastrous for the population. The Neo-liberal shock doctrine killed about 11 million people. And your reaction is a smile ?

If you compare Russia in the 90s versus Russia during soviet times, that clearly proves that the ML system worked, and Neo-liberalism doesn't.
>>

 No.7492

>>7481
>Have feudalism
>Life bad
>Change to socialism
>Life good
>Change to capitalism
>Life bad
<Socialism bad

Good logic, retard
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 No.7493

>>7490
>Libs argued that enterprise managers can spend money more efficiently than the state.

Okay the next time we try this, which I hope is soon, will the people please recognize the liberal for what they really are? Wreckers, fascists, and power hungry racists.
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 No.7494

File: 1705439262365.jpg ( 154.14 KB , 800x800 , gommie-pov.jpg )

>>7489
dunno about fascists, but marxist intellectuals expect unrealistically high growth rates because of idealism that is widespread with people in their class position (as an administrative strata between the ruling class and the proles they don't have their own ideology and so tend to gravitate to the either pole of the main class divide)

such people are generally fascinated with various philosophical castles in the sky, and diamat is one such construct

and in the diamat discourse it is perfectly logical (lol) to expect double digit growth after you resolve "the contradiction".. because laws of dialectics that move history or something (even tho history is subject to more general actual laws of thermodynamics lol)

Obviously when it comes to practice, reality doesn't give a fuck about their """laws""" and fucks them over without lube, hence their eternal search for the scapegoats

Realistically marxoids can expect the growth rate of the late soviet union - 2%. Gosplan at the end calculated that implementing computer-aided plan optimizations would give another 1% max

So 3%, and that's without taking into account planning mistakes (that ARE gonna happen) and inefficiencies in implementation. Obvious problem for MLtards is that their political superstructure CANNOT deal with such growth rates in a somewhat large (and especially multi-ethnic) soyciety. You get dissatisfaction from the wide masses of people (proletariat, peasantry, intelligentsia, even party elite). The system gets highly unstable. All it takes for the house of cards to collapse is for intelligentsia or some section of the party elite to mobilize the proletariat and you can say goodbye to your Real Existing Soycialism kek
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 No.7495

>>7484
>tho I'm being unfair to marxist-leninist comrades
>they have obviously meticulously analyzed the past experiences
>and as a result achieved a theoretical-strategic breakthrough
Unironically yes

Most MLs have adopted Paul Cockshotts criticism of the Soviet system, and his contributions on how to fix the problems.

Sortition democracy with democratic polling, will fix the political system the Soviets had. Sortition democracy isn't vulnerable to sell-outs that try to privatize everything. So there's no need for political violence like purges.

Cockshott also proposed his economic system that uses labor-time and resource calculations instead of money calculations. That will create an economic structure, of workplaces connected by material flows, that will be entirely in the hands of the proles.
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 No.7496

File: 1705440464838.jpeg ( 28.76 KB , 474x474 , batem.jpeg )

>>7492
>Life good
>Collapses anyway

Good logic, retard
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 No.7497

File: 1705440596739.jpg ( 5.39 KB , 480x360 , nico.jpg )

>>7490
hello illiterate spergoid

we were talking about Albania
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 No.7498

File: 1705440970327.jpeg ( 12.43 KB , 474x314 , you-serious.jpeg )

<When life is so GOOD that it collapses EVERY TIME
here'a some food for thought leninoids: maybe try making life a little less good so that your soycialism doesn't keep COLLAPSING LMAOOOOOOOOOO
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 No.7502

File: 1705442281733.gif ( 1.6 MB , 300x168 , born-to-die.gif )

>>7491
>And your reaction is a smile ?
Yes. Billions will die.

You can from the get-go spare yourself all the trouble by offing yourself right away too lol. You weren't expecting to survive the third world war and the third revolutionary wave, weren't you retard kek?

While I'm gonna go prepare some popcorn and enjoy the show. In the long run we are all dead, but I'm curious about the trajectory.
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 No.7503

>>7491
Also, really shit argument. The effects of the dissolution of the Russian Empire were no less disastrous.

The effects of any social dissolution are in general disastrous (duh).
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 No.7505

>>7495
>Most MLs have adopted Paul Cockshotts criticism of the Soviet system, and his contributions on how to fix the problems.
so "most MLs" are not vanguardists anymore?

you know that he calls situation in the USSR a party dictatorship, and not dictatorship of the proletariat, right? you know that he calls Stalin a tyrant, right? he's actually closer to trotskyists like Mandel in this regard who thought USSR required a political revolution to fully complete its transition to socialism

I really can't wrap my head around how you retards are gonna square the circle that direct democracy is ANTITHETICAL to political party as an ORGANIZATIONAL FORM by it's VERY NATURE with your leninoid wankings lol

my bet is that you're just too low autism score to understand the implications for your movement lol

Lenin (and any party functioner) would've shot you if you told him party form is gotta go lol
>>

 No.7506

>>7495
also, I don't really give a fuck about "most MLs"

I only give a fuck about "few" MLs like our Best Korean monarchist comrades and our Cuban comrades

and they sure as fuck aren't adopting shit, especially anti-party political reforms
>>

 No.7507

>>7502
fatalism is stupid

>>7503
The feudal monarchical structures in pre-revolutionairy Russia never stood a chance, they were 100 years behind on industrial development. If there hadn't been a communist revolution, there might have been a bourgeois revolution which probably would have been a lot more destructive. Or possible an imperial occupation by a more powerful capitalist country, which would also have been a brutal affair.

The dissolution of the Soviet system wasn't inevitable, that system could have been reformed. Even a regression to capitalism could have been done without neo-liberal shock doctrine killing millions.

So no, your comparison doesn't track.
>>

 No.7508

>>7505
>so "most MLs" are not vanguardists anymore?
Vanguardism never was a end in it self, it was a means to keep opportunistic sell-outs from hijacking political power to enrich them selves at the expense of wrecking the socialist project.
Since we now have the ability to achieve the same thing with other much more pleasant means, like sortition and democratic polling, we use those. If you want you still can have a vanguard that bootstraps these other means.

>I really can't wrap my head around how you retards are gonna square the circle that direct democracy is ANTITHETICAL to political party as an ORGANIZATIONAL FORM

The goal is to build a socialist society that operates a socialist mode of production, the political party is just a means to that end. If there's a better way we'll use that.
>Lenin would've shot you if you told him party form is gotta go
Probably, but in the early 20th century the communication technology couldn't have facilitated democratic polling, so there was no alternative to the "party form". State-of-the-art technology of that time were telegraph machines.
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 No.7509

File: 1705456500081.mp4 ( 5.7 MB , 640x272 , Courier 1986.mp4 )

>>7505
>who thought USSR required a political revolution to fully complete its transition to socialism
which, if you really think about it, is beyond ironic: Real Existing Socialism was far more threatened by the real proletarian uprising than capitalism ever was lol (solidarity fucking killed PRL even with the martial law, enormous crowds of proles made SCSE officials shit their pants live on tv, Chechoslovakia descended into fucking chaos lol)

tho I'm not so sure soyciety in vid related is capable of any historically progressive revolution at all (not that capitalist soyciety is capable of any either lol)
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 No.7511

>>7507
>fatalism is stupid
histmat is deterministic (in the sense of irreversible processes)

>If there hadn't been a communist revolution, there might have been a bourgeois revolution which probably would have been a lot more destructive.

there WAS a bourgeois revolution (February revolution) lol

it fucking failed because of ww1

this is fucking BASICS

>that system could have been reformed

could it really, tho? lol

this actually re-poses the old question on a new level: reform or revolution in the Real Existing Soycialism?

My opinion: revolution.

Reformism is as retarded in the soviet case as in the capitalist case. Class societies are unreformable.

>Even a regression to capitalism could have been done without neo-liberal shock doctrine killing millions.

Doubt. Chinese scenario was unapliccable - different levels of economic development and different state structures (federal vs unitary). Shock doctrine was necessary for capitalism, as was proven by the Black October events.

Again, determinism bitch. You have far less control over the events than you think you have lol.
>>

 No.7512

>>7497
>>7498
>It's good but it collapsed
this is equivalent to saying
<It's bad because it collapsed
But that's retarded anon. It didn't collapse because conditions were bad for the average worker. It collapsed because of internal and external political reasons. We should acknowledge their successes and failures and try again but avoiding the failures.

Unique IPs: 6

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