/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

>>449782
Can I ask the right wingers a question in here?

Do you even know what it's like to be a big strong, virile Chad?

Right wingers seem to in general be like angry sadistic lockershoved bullies who fantasize about women they don't know fervently. They do things such as eat humans or torture cats. That is not "Chad" behavior.

Just wondering if any Right Wingers in here know what it's like to be a real feminine, sensitive man who respects women and animals, even bugs.

>>459938
So true!

>>460137
Why are they all blonde?

I don't really see the point of debate. Nothing really needs to be said. Marxism is dead. You know it, and many of us know it. Communism today is just a meme. A post-1960's Gladio boogeyman that the system uses to scare NatSocs into dragging us back into some conveniant position for their anti-socialist suppression. It's a boogeyman the systme blames for its own market liberal capitalist faults. The litnay of conservative grifters cry out "it's those damn marxists running the system" as wall street gets another bailout. Marxism is not a threat. It's an ideological sandbox for people still stuck in the post-war moral mental labyrinth. Just look at this board. It's dead. Look at reddit communist boards. Dead. No movements, no popular support. The last spark was Corbynism and it was crushed with ease by the system, and it's crushing was a result of Marxists refusing to understand race or the racial hierarchy of the system we live in. Youur solidarity is so broken, you split your dead marxist boards into two different boards over minor differences. Honestly, I'd have no problem with putting on a red beret and yelling workers of the world unite in a glorious revolt against capitalism, but it's not going to happen. You just don't understand this system, who runs it, why they run it the way they do and how you are manipulated by it. For this reason alone, you will always fail. You will always be manipulated into failure. You will be infiltrated, dominated and lured into the same pitfalls of the last seven decades. You refuse to learn from the past. You refuse to admit the reality of race. Admittedly, alot of NatSocs don't get this either. They think they do, but they don't, but you certainly don't. Corbynism was defeated by Zionism. Memo's were written about this, by Marxists, and did they learn from this? No. Marxists have consistently lost for seven decades against Liberalism and its zionist hierarchy. Marxism has capitulated at every step. While Nazi Germany had to be destroyed by three world empires, made up of an alliance of communists and capitalists - it's revolution was butchered to a man, fighting to the bitter end. Meanwhile, the late great Soviet Union was sold at a yard sale, sold off piece by piece, without fanfare, and without a shot being fired. That is the legacy of Marxism; Capitulation and failure. A worldview created for the express purpose of undermining European Socialism at its time, elevating a state that executed anti-semites, and then demolished when that same state was overtaken by slavic nationalism and emerged as an anti-zionist threat.

Honestly, what is there to argue? What can you offer me and my people? You're a dead worldview that can't even maintain unions. You can't maintain enough solidarity to have one board. What could your dead worldview and dead boards offer me and my people? More ridiculous theory, as capitalism crushes my people. More whimsical fantasies of some global republic, even as ethnic divisions gain more violent momentum? More ridiculous notions of racial blindness, as my people are accused of blood libel and openly vilified by the system? What do you offer me and my people that National Socialism does not? Our martyrs and dissidents are numerous. Our influence grows despite our rampant persecution. Good men and women are crushed by this system for speaking out for my people. I have no doubt some of you naively celebrate this, out of some vindictive vicaruous desire for power that you don't have and never will.

I'll say this. I respect you Marxists. More than anyone else. The libertarians are slaves or slavers. The Liberals are status-seeking cowards. The conservatives are broken house slaves. You wield a revolutionary spirit. I like that in you people. You understand this system is illegitimate, immoral and evil. You want it gone, but you will never achieve that. You couldn't when we held power, you didn't when we were annhilated, and you have only lost more despite not having us as a competitor.
You are a dead worldview, a meme, a myriad of books no one will ever read. A dead board, mocked by your own dead politic.

You cannot offer us anything.

>>460292
>Nothing really needs to be said. Marxism is dead.
And yet you felt the need to say it.
I guess Marxism isn't dead after-all.

You can't really refute Marx's arguments about economics or material reality in general, and hence you seek to socially discredit his ideas instead. It's very obvious.

>>460292
Marxism has influenced more people on earth arguably than the bible.

>>460315
And just like Christians, most marxists don't read the damned book.

>>460296
>You can't really refute Marx's arguments about economics
what if I told you national socialists believe in socialist economics.

>>461130
B b b based

>>461130
I would ask you what you think socialist economics are.

Hey hey people, christian fanatic here.
First time posting here.
On the topic of superstructures: Marx said
>The mode of production of material life conditions the general process of social, political, and intellectual life.
And:
>The changes in the economic foundation lead, sooner or later, to the transformation of the whole, immense, superstructure. In studying such transformations, it is always necessary to distinguish between the material transformation of the economic conditions of production, which can be determined with the precision of natural science, and the legal, political, religious, artistic, or philosophic—in short, ideological forms in which men become conscious of this conflict and fight it out.
As explained by CatAnon on leftypol.org, this means basically that commies don't know what will happen with the superstructure once communism will be enacted, but only how "the base" will operate in such an environment (i.e. communist environment).
From my understanding, it's actually just Marx not being able to explain what is the value of these kind of jobs. For example, how would you value the work of a artist? I mean, these jobs are inherently capitalistic (i.e. they are prone to an application of classic economics' laws first and foremost) in nature: the "best" one will sell more, and become subsequentially rich.
My question is: if the media is a superstructure, the lack of criteriae that determines whether or not a specific structure of this market is part of the communist society will prevent the determination by the people part of said society of its characteristics, leading to a paradox: in a communist society there may be people (read as: "glowies") working in the media who will claim that the society is not communist, and by doing so preventing the proletarians to acknowledge the fact that they indeed achieved such a feat (i.e. creating a communist society) at last. In other words, the glowies, through the means provided by the media, can create a post-truth that can prevent the creation of a communist society altogether, prior, during and even after its constitution.
Likewise, a glowie can create a fallacious society and declare it "communist", proving that its crumbling is due to the Marxist theory to be flawed.
So my question is: if the mind cannot see (also read as: "comprehend", "actualize", but also "define") the existance of communism in the real world, how will it be achieved in the first place?
>>449970
>believe
Idolatry is a sin, anon.

>>463359
This is literally insane pshycobable
What do you mean by how would art be "valued in communism?" Art would be valued exactly as it is now. E.G Subjectively. And of course no one knows what will happen with certainty but you can make educated guesses and deductions by extrapolating from what happens now.

For example, because of capitalism the current mode of production is mainly driven by the accumulation of profits, so, this creates a system of alienation where people become further and further from one another because any time you are not producing profits or generating profits in some way is time spent not making money for the capitalist overlords.
We can see this in social media like tictok, facebook, fbi.gov, instagram, etc etc etc where your every moved is bought and sold to investors to sell you targeted ads.

What you are saying makes no sense and is frankly kind of silly. Like media as we know it wouldn't even exist under communism. Media as it exists today is used as a means to enforce the capitalist hegemony. Building socialism is something that is done by the masses so there's little reason to believe that anyone retard would have any attention paid to him. It just doesn't make sense.

>>463361
>This is literally insane pshycobable
My deepest apologies, anon. English is not my first language, you see, so I tend to express myself in a quite uncanny way.
>What do you mean by how would art be "valued in communism?"
Clearly, I am talking here about the economic aspects of value, because I am talking about an economic theory (i.e. the marxist economic theory). In other words, I rhetorically asked how would you pay an artist in a communist society? By the number of books he sells? He will become extremely rich. What about an actor, then? On the number of movies he is part of? Can he contract his salary? What if he is famous? In that case, he would have such a bargaining power, that he will make the film director go broke! Also, how will movies be made? Will the proles have a whip-round for the film?
Last example: what if I don't wanna work. I will say I work as an artist, specifically a trap artist, and publish one album each month. Will I be entitled to receive a pay for it? What if I suck?
>this creates a system of alienation where people become further and further from one another because any time you are not producing profits or generating profits in some way is time spent not making money for the capitalist overlords.
Why would isolation be an effect of capitalism? From my perspective, capitalism tries to reroute social interations through means that will produce profit, not reduce their numbers. As we can see, social networks have increased to such an extent social interactions, that the apocalyptic future described by John B. Calhoun doesn't seem so distant after all.
>What you are saying makes no sense and is frankly kind of silly.
And yet you agree with me by saying:
>Media as it exists today is used as a means to enforce the capitalist hegemony.
I have to point out that we (you and me) actually disagree on one thing. I argued in my previous post that media can be used to enforce any political ideology hegemony, not only the capitalist one. For media stands for mass media, which is a mode of mass communication. But communication of what, you might ask? I argue it started out as a mean to transfer informations to a (throughout history) progressively large audience (first it was the bourgeoisie, then the proletariat, then both of them considered together, etc. ). This characteristic is still to this day key to define what mass media means. Such characteristic, in my opinion, will translate in a communist society, while other key features present in the mass media of the capitalist societies (like propaganda) will be eliminated in the "communist-type" mass media.
>Building socialism is something that is done by the masses
I partially disagree: socialism will be built by the masses under the direction of certain people who will coordinate the work. How would you otherwise build a factory? Will you rely on a hivemind? I hope not.
You need not only the directors in this deed, but a strong IS (cfr. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Information_system, for an introductory page on the topic) that will adjuvate the directors in their operation. The IS, if considered in a broader setting of society as a whole, corresponds to mass media.
>there's little reason to believe that anyone retard would have any attention paid to him.
Let me specify: you are saying that retards will not be paid attention to? I have to go a little bit of topic now, but how do you explain Gorbachev then? With all the due respect, he and Yeltsin were a little bit unstable, yet they arrived to such positions that made them considerably powerful. I agree they are not part of the media, but, especially with Yeltsin, people voted for him because he was a very public figure.
Honestly, I consider them both glowie's assets, which reached a point where they could condition proles into thinking that private property's what they (the proles) needed.
Why wouldn't in the media sector happen what happened in the political sector of USSR?

>>463364
>how would you pay
>communist society
I believe that I have discovered the source of your confusion.

>>463373
Trully a great mistake on my part, anon. Apologies! I have unconsciously thought that 2 Thessalonians 3:10 would apply to communism as well, not only to the socialist phase.
Nevertheless, I do still consider it necessary in a communist society some kind of control to exist. For what will happen if every manchild will claim to be a worker, by streaming Nuzlocke runs on Twitch everyday?

>>463383
Everyone deserves the basic necessities. Water, foo, shelter, clothing, etc etc.

It's har dto flesh out what your qualm exactly even is. Epecially since you, rather annoyingly, keep using green text to cherry pick peoples arguments apart leading to things that could be answered simply by reading the whole conversation.

I didn't say that isolation effects capitalism in a negative way. It effects people in a negative way. Capitalism needs this alienation as, again, as I said, when people are not producing profits for capital that is time spent not makign money for capital owners. I also gave examples so how you are arguing against this reality is beyond me, but, it is not unlike ancpas and other autsrians to deny reality.


Your ahistorical acceptance of great man theory makes it impossible for you to understand what we are talking about because you do not see the world as a historical accumulation of forces which lead men to act in certain ways. But you see it as people just rising to the occasion free of the influence of historical and material forces. All in vaccuum.

People don't pay attention to nazis now and they wnt pay attention to retards under a socialistic mode of production.

>All right wing nonsense posted outside of this thread will be subject to a deletion hence forth if deemed necessary.
Isn't it about time this thread was unstickied and replaced with something more congruent with the moderation beliefs of this webzone? It's quite apparent we have actual Nazis lurking around the topic of Ukraine in other threads now.

>>463767
>It's quite apparent we have actual Nazis lurking around the topic of Ukraine in other threads now.
Natoids are not necessary nazoids. Libs are natoids too.

Majority of ziggers on the other hand are nazoids too, only draped in red. Which deserves even harsher punishment, because in the final analysis the primary enemy of communist movement is social fascism.

If we ban nazis we should ban ziggers and right socdems in general too.

also to all the social fascists who read this, before you sperg out, by nazoids I mean socdem national chauvinists, ie - you
the difference is that nazoids become full blown nazis only when faced with the radical proletarian movement, what they tended to call "bolshevism"

Mussolini is the prime example of a nazoid in his early syndicalist days

>>463767
>>463768
How about we don't ban leftists for not agreeing with you on certain principles? I assume that we are all on a chan, because we don't want to be on a reddit. These "nazi" accusations are nothing more than the mad flailings of faggots who can't argue a point. inb4 oh, you must really be a nazi yourself then.

>>463772
I don't want mods to ban anyone except spammers (repeated same messages), CP (not cartoons), and guro (not cartoons).

I'm just pointing out the sheer absurdity of ziggers crying to ban nazoids.
Like, bitch, you will be the first to go lol.

>>463772
>These "nazi" accusations are nothing more than the mad flailings of faggots who can't argue a point.
Mmm, it's a bit more than that at this point. What do you call someone repeating ancient Nazi propaganda about the "Holodomor", constantly talks about how people from some adjacent nationality are subhuman and takes glee in their deaths? If it walks and talks like a Nazi, it's probably an actual Nazi. Now I don't have any problem debating bad Nazi arguments, but isn't the whole point of this thread to contain them within here? If that is the point, why are they allowed to spew their nonsense outside of it? If that is not the point of this thread anymore, then it's about time this thread was retired.

>>463778
>What do you call someone repeating ancient Nazi propaganda about the "Holodomor"
Liberals do the same thing. The Victims of Communism people are all liberals.
>constantly talks about how people from some adjacent nationality are subhuman and takes glee in their deaths
I've definitely heard liberals do that.
>If it walks and talks like a Nazi, it's probably an actual Nazi.
Or it could be a lolbert. That's the thing–until they start talking about ethnostates, jewish conspiracies, and the aryan master race it is impossible to differentiate nazis from liberals.

i dont really get you guys. Nazis worship death aesthetic, is the op pic meant to demoralize them or moralize you? skulls = look cool

>>464053
>is the op pic meant to demoralize them
considering that it's a skull of a nazi - yes

it's cool and edgy to carry insignia with a skull - until it dawns on you that it was your skull all along lol

I'm honestly ignorant about these phenomenon, so if someone wants to explain or guide me towards resources to better understand them, I'd be glad to take a look.

>>464367
Gentrification is when wealthy people come to town and jack up the cost of living for everyone else due to real estate speculation. Most white people aren't wealthy. White flight is when working-class whites with enough financial assets to relocate leave an area that is being deindustrialized by capitalists who have abandoned the area to seek cheaper labor elsewhere.

How does the shortcomings in Engel's analysis of indigenous civilizations(including outdated ideas on how "savage" these populations were, along with other outdated ideas on measuring their intelligence) affect how we should view his further findings today?

>>464780
The noble savage idea has to be canned.

There is also the idea that hunter gatherer societies were all egalitarian primitive communism. Some of them were but others definitely were not.

<How the world works
<The story of human labor from prehistory to the modern day
by Paul Cockshott

does a better job of describing early human society

Why did the Politburo deny the kolkhozy access to seed loans in 1932? They seemed well aware that the collective farms had no seed to plant after already having to deal with poor quality soil, so this makes no sense to me. What context justifies this?

>>453213
>nationalization for the good of the people
Explain how that's any different from what a social democrat would tell me.

>>453213
any division other than class is antimaterialist and retarded, putting poor jews in camps isnt gonna magically bring about communism retard

>>453213
>He thinks Nazis had an economy based on need and not profit.


God damn Nazis are stupid.

>>453213

>>466866
that's euphemism… buuuut, there's a small chance they can change their world views(if they choose to interact with communists for some reason).
it would probably be like this: nazi -> nazbol -> (actual bolshevism) -> marxism(hopefully) -> whatever far-left/radical left stuff

>>466867
>implying nazbol is a political current instead of a fringe political party that existed in Russia from 1994 to 2005

>implying bolsheviks weren't Marxist

>implying there's a higher stage of leftism than marxism

You need to have a combat-liberalism struggle session

>>466868
>>466868
You're hung up on historical fart huffing. Just because something existed in the past doesn't mean it cannot be reborn again currently with adopted and borrowed ideology and aesthetics as a new thing.

>>463359
>While we recognize that in the general development of history the material determines the mental and social being determines social consciousness, we also - and indeed must - recognize the reaction of mental on material things, of social consciousness on social being and of the superstructure on the economic base. This does not go against materialism; on the contrary, it avoids mechanical materialism and firmly upholds dialectical materialism.
I finally found the answer to my question. You helped me less than I expected.
I suspect this >>463361 and this >>463385 anon are either glowies or just people who learned about communism through Youtube videos.

>>466868
>implying there's a higher stage of leftism than marxism
I think there is actually, since marxism is always being destroyed by the US(so marxism isn't working because of the US), unlike Juche, the only one that is actually still alive and the imperialism of the US proved unable obliterate it.
I believe that marxism-leninism needs an update, specifically regarding technology, such as replacing proprietary software with free(https://www.fsf.org/about/what-is-free-software) software, since using proprietary software only helps the technology bourgeoisie(big tech, companies, etc), and also expropriating all proprietary software/hardware from the tech bourgeoisie, making source code/hardware designs accessible for everyone and forcefully copylefted forever, so the people have power over their own computing- not companies, thus making the tech bourgeoisie lose everything and cease to exist(imagine a world where facebook(meta), twitter, intel, alphabet and etc doesn't exist because they have been violently expropriated).
>You need to have a combat-liberalism struggle session
I suppose I do, I want to understand deeply this kind of stuff, so I still have much to read.

>>466902
>I think there is actually, since marxism is always being destroyed by the US(so marxism isn't working because of the US), unlike Juche, the only one that is actually still alive and the imperialism of the US proved unable obliterate it.
I think that's only true for a historically finite period roughly from 1990 to 2030. After the sunset of the US empire, there's not going to be a capitalist power that can just kill off the formation of new socialist countries.

>I believe that marxism-leninism needs an update, specifically regarding technology, such as replacing proprietary software with freesoftware
That's true
>and also expropriating all proprietary software/hardware from the tech bourgeoisie, making source code/hardware designs accessible for everyone and forcefully copylefted forever
I agree in principle, but the development model shapes how tech is build and structured.
I wonder if it's not better to slowly phase out proprietary tech and move to opensource tech that's purposefully designed to be open. You know there is a consideration of how much technical debt people are willing to put up with, when switching the development model.

(セリフ)悪魔の森の奥深く
一見 何の変哲もない古い屋敷
ただ その一室からは 毎夜毎晩
少女の悲鳴にも似た
叫び声が聞こえるとか
聞こえないとか
お前も蝋人形にしてやろうか
お前も蝋人形にしてやろうか

霧の立ち込む森の奥深く
少女を運ぶ謎の老人
誰も知らぬ秘密の館
生きたまま蝋人形の如く
震えて眠れ 明日はもうないさ
今夜もひとり生贄になる
手足も口も動かぬままに

身の毛もよだつ悪魔の芸術
裸の少女に迫る惨劇
窓に映る殺人儀式
壁にとび散る生き血のしぶきが
助けてくれと叫んでいるのさ
今夜もひとり人形になる
堕ちていく恐怖の淵に

夜 残酷な時 悪魔は笑い
神々悶え 人形は泣き
元に戻せと 今日も叫ぶ
(You shall never return home ha! ha!)

生きたまま蝋人形の如く
震えて眠れ 明日はもうないさ
La la la la la
La la la la la…

運命の波間に飲まれ
まだ見ぬ世界
永遠の眠りに息もたてず
死界の果て

今、黒い羽根をつけた体
翔びたち光り
悪魔の血を受けた心
叫べよ今すぐに
神と悪魔の 洗礼を受けた
奴の名は EXECUTIONER

光と闇との中で
生まれ滅ぶ
無限の命そして魂
さまよう夢

今、黒い羽根をつけた体
翔びたち光り
悪魔の血を受けた心
叫べよい 今すぐに
終わりなき処刑 地獄への扉
奴の名は EXECUTIONER

心の叫び
STORMY NIGHT
Shock!
駆け抜けたおまえの視線が
Rock!
絡みつく炎のようだ
Lovely, bloody, storm in night
In the lovely, bloody, STORMY NIGHT

Oh! 悩ましく囁く声が
Crash!
狂わせる呪文のようだ
Lovely, bloody, storm in night
In the lovely, bloody, STORMY NIGHT

Night!
吸いつくす おもあえの生き血を
Bright!
溶けてゆく ふたつの炎が
Lovely, bloody, storm in night
In the lovely, bloody, STORMY NIGHT
Lovely, bloody, storm in night
In the lovely, bloody, STORMY NIGHT

悪魔の穴
神代の昔より
墓石破壊し下の道
通ずる穴は暗い闇
黒の階段降りたれば
悪魔 悪魔
悪魔こぞりて住み家とす
黄金の祭壇開けたれば
三首の竜 天に舞ゆ


KILL THE KING GIDLAH

DEAD SYMPHONY
ダイ、ダイナマイトで
腐った あ、頭を ぶ、ぶちこわせ
尖った ナ、ナイフで
は、腹わたを切り刻め
鎖鎌片手に悪魔が来たりて
頭が吹き飛んだ
血の海 飲み干せ
I will kill you
by DEAD SYMPHONY

悪魔が来たりて 目玉が砕けた
真赤な地球さ

ダ、ダンプで
う、うすのろのうじ虫をひきつぶせ
狂った ド、ドリルで
の、脳ミソをえぐりだせ
舌を抜け 鼻をそげ
爪をはげ はげ はげ はげ
脊髄へし折れた
毒の粉 世界に ぶちまけ

BATTLER
フハハハハハ
汝迷える子羊たちよ
闇の中を進む
怪しい彗星の光を見たか?
そうだ、賢明なる諸君なら
すべて気づいている通り
あの不吉な光こそ
我々デーモン一族の
襲来を告げるものなのだ
今後地球上には我々の魔力による
恐ろしい災い、惨事が
次々に起こるだろう
そして今世紀末、
愚かな人類は
何も気づかぬうちに
自らの手によって
滅亡するのだ
そうだ、すべて我々の思惑通り
死にたくなかろう、フハハハハ
死にたくなければ
毎晩寝る前に
このレコードを聞くのだ
ちゃんと歯を磨いてからだぞ
不幸にも
このレコードを買ってしまった
哀れな子羊たちよ
これを一度聞いた者は
悪魔に心を売ったのと
同じなのだ
レコードを買って
心を売ったのだから
差し引きゼロだ
フハハハ……
そろそろお別れの時間のようだ
汝たちと悪魔のミサで会えることを
楽しみにしておるぞ
ではまた会おう!
フハハハ……
ところで、
著作者に無断でテープ等に
ダビングすることは
悪魔が許さない…

数えきれぬ女を Fascination
宴の主役集めて All right
今宵の火遊びは Conjuration
ひとときの夢ときめかせ Hold tight

胸の谷間に赤いバラ (Fall into the trap)
ワイン片手に血まつりだ (Calling down the help)
Hey! Hey! Hey! Enjoy forever

Woo Flowing like a burnin' blood

お前らの行く先は Cancellation
夢の続き見せてやる Good night

俺の胸に刻まれた (Slowly going mad)
"愛"という名の文字はない (Only glowing sad)
Hey! Hey! Hey! Sleep forever

Burnin' up, have no pities 焼き付くせ
燃えつきた瞳で
Burnin' up, all the ladies 焼き付くせ
また一人少女が Laid down

胸の谷間に赤いバラ (Fall into the trap)
ワイン片手に血まつりだ (Calling down the help)
Hey! Hey! Hey! Enjoy forever
Hey! Hey! Hey! Scream forever

Burnin' up, have no pities 焼き付くせ
魔性の血がたぎる
Burnin' up, all the ladies 焼き付くせ
安らぎはないのさ
Burnin' up, have no pities 焼き付くせ
涙もかれるまで
Burnin' up, all the cities 焼き付くせ
燃える街 背にして
Burnin' up, have no pities 焼き付くせ
燃えつきた瞳で
Burnin' up, all the ladies 焼き付くせ
また一人少女が
Burnin' up……

I think raping all blacks should not only be supported but legal.

>>468012
We love blacks here sir

>>468012
Sure thing, timmy.

>>468068
Yes yesss… now be a good little trayvon and get on all four.

>>468012
Have you tried to offer her some flowers instead ?

why is left better than right

aren't they two sides of the same coin and two opposing sides which complement and balance out each other?

>>469157
left is only better than right when it has something to offer since it tends to be progressive
todays left currently offers us nothing of the sort, it gave up on postcapitalism and cant go beyond le culture war
it might change in the future but all we have now are different varieties of the right, even among so-called leftists
in general the rightist perspective can be valuable and shouldnt be dismissed outright but as a politics it always leads to nothing but stagnation, decadence and war
leftist politics seems to be more like a coinflip in this regard

How do right-wingers reconcile the connections between elite pedophile ring cases and international, right-wing, anti-communist, parapolitical networks?
International fascism was provably supported by the glowies and real elite throughout the cold war. The most generous interpretation of the relationship I can come up with is that you fascists were useful idiots who were discarded when you were no longer useful, much like how the New Left in the 20th century were anti-communist controlled opposition, who are now open supporters of the establishment, or how "wokies" are currently useful idiots for elite agendas that will be discarded when they're no longer useful.