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/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

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File: 1777446158361.jpeg ( 155.59 KB , 960x960 , IMG_3621.jpeg )

 No.496031

The Democratic socialist party of America is a bullshit zionist piece of dog shit
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 No.496032

True.
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 No.496035

>>496031
do you mean the DSA? It's just a caucus for the democrap party
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 No.496036

>>496031
>>496035
But Sarah Silverman left the Democratic Socialists of America after being a member for several years, citing their published response to the initial Hamas attacks and lack of support for Israel. Explain?
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 No.496041

They couldn't even hold people accountable that they endorsed for repeatedly voting to send Israel weapons.
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 No.496043

https://www.ajc.org/news/democratic-socialists-of-america-who-they-are-and-their-stance-on-israel
AJC (American Jewish Committee) says DSA moved away from their Michael Harrington era pro-Israel stance to a more anti-Zionist stance. Explain?
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 No.496066

>>496036
So what? They're not really socialist. It's a way to funnel young people away from valid communist vanguards and direct action..
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 No.496067

>>496066
>direct action
Petty crimes?
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 No.496071

>>496070
Accomplished nothing except a state crackdown on anarchists.
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 No.496194

>>496071
Also killed the president.
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 No.496198

>>496194
Did that change even a single policy?
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 No.496200

>>496198
If not, then the lesson is they needed to kill more people, infiltrate more, do more damage, and exert more prolonged pressure. Killing the president is a way better start towards an objective than anything anarchists are doing today, and the vast majority of what socialists are doing today, and it obviously can impact policy or James Angleton wouldn't have had a need to kill JFK. So this is really the problem, we'd be in a better position to criticize the guy who shot McKinley if we ourselves were actually doing better; instead, we're doing worse, but we criticize anyway.
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 No.496203

>>496200
Any leftist capable of rubbing two sticks together knows that the government isn't run by a single diabological man who makes all the decisions. It's an oligarchy formed by the vested interests of capitalists. You won't stop an oligarchy with assassinations, you need an actual organized revolution to dismantle it.
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 No.496205

>>496203
>You won't stop an oligarchy with assassinations,
Yeah, you can actually.
Killing oligarchs would be insanely effective. I agree that the president, for a revolutionary force (as opposed to an internal coup like with JFK), is not a priority target, but it's still way better than nothing.

The fact of the matter is that, today, the left has neither anarchist assassins nor an organized revolutionary force. It's not the fault of the early 20th century left! They were better in both categories than the left of today, and they also were much less into wanking themselves into a frenzy about how any and every action is wrong. The left today just offers very little - the best it can boast are mutual aid & community programs which are a distant shadow of previous efforts. If it was evident that the left of today was building with great effectiveness, that would be one thing; but it isn't evident so far. If even one person or group from the left was actually capable of killing the president today, the left on the whole would be completely unprepared for the repercussions because the left on the whole, in the USA, barely even functions under the current level of (constantly increasing) repression. We have a serious problem where these orgs, even if they admit to being enemies of the capitalist status quo, do not act like it - and because of this, they lose some appeal they might have to those who are most hurt by the status quo.
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 No.496209

>>496205
I'd like to see some history to corroborate this assertion. All the historical examples I can think of had generally no effect or lead to a (successful) counter-reaction on the part of the oligarchic class to check any threats to their system. It seems difficult to stop a ruling class with assassinations when it operates as a class. You can only meet their organized class action with your own organized class action.
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 No.496210

>>496209
this is ignoring the fact that lenin, mao and che were all critical of terrorism (political assassinations included)
the contemporary incarnation of this impulse isnt even political though, all the ideological veneer is just a justification for what feels good
they want a moral license to kill the bad people
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 No.496213

>>496210
Lenin robbed banks and killed the Tsar's whole family, though. Like, this is my point, this stuff clearly has practical applications or, historically, it wouldn't be done by a number of victors. Direct action, even on the level of theft is obviously useful - so is sabotage, and there's no reason to purposefully not have the ability to carry out assassinations even if it's not the most important tool in asymmetric war. An assassination which fails to spark revolution, provided it was actually done by opponents of the capitalist state, is still a way closer swing than a long peaceful series of marches which also fail.
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 No.496234

>>496203
this is a false dichotomy. yes a single or even handful of assassination attempts will not fundamentally change the capitalist system but at the same time if you don't think it has profound effects on said system then you are either naive or intentionally obfuscating the impact because you fash sympathizer that understands that they could also be in the cross hairs
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 No.496235

>>496234
>if you don't agree you're X
There's been many assassinations throughout history. Feel free to present some data to support your assertion.
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 No.496236

>>496213
Lenin had an enormous army organized when the Tsar's family were executed. It wasn't some small assassination operation.
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 No.496237

>>496235
>Guies, violence doesn't work. Don't even try it!
<Meanwhile booj spend Trillions, with a T, on weapons
>I'm not a crypto fash, honest!
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 No.496238

File: 1778371220423.png ( 25.17 KB , 300x300 , glowofficer.png )

>>496237
Understood, officer.
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 No.496259

>>496236
He still did it, so clearly it had some utility.
And before that, Lenin expropriated funds from banks to fund the growth of the party.
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 No.496265

>>496237
There's a difference between a fucking nuclear warhead and a fucking brick through window, uyghur.
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 No.496266

>>496265
False dichotomy, the western left barely even manages to arm with guns, and they absolutely should. Also, the supply lines for capitalist/zionist weapons are right in front of them - maybe a brick through a window wouldn't do the trick, but it's absurd to pretend that sabotaging the production and transportation and finance flow of arms exclusively used by imperialist enemies of the working class isn't valuable. It's extremely valuable, and anyone who's serious about striking blows against the empire should be able to do it; dismissing the ability entirely is incredibly foolish while the zionists and their collaborators aim to utilize leftist passivity to advance their surveillance capacity unchallenged.
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 No.496267

>>496266
You're never, ever, going to convince Americans that violence is the answer. It's never going to happen. "Terrorism" or, actions perceived as such, only makes people more radically right wing.
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 No.496268

>>496238
>Y-you're the glowie. Violence only works when the state does it! Political assassinations don't work. That's why the CIA does them, to show you all how much they don't work!
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 No.496269

>>496265
Why do the booj spend so much on their own security if killing them has no effect on capitalism. Very inefficient use of capital if you ask me!
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 No.496273

>>496268
False equivalence. The CIA does assassinations in favor of a prevailing class domination. Assassinations in the opposing direction however are rarely successful or useful.
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 No.496275

>>496269
because they value their own life? they don't want to die or get hurt?
are you fucking retarded?
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 No.496276

>>496273
>It's different when you kill us. Don't try it, you're just wasting your time.
If you're doing a class analysis then wouldn't it be in the dominate class' interest to LIE about the effectiveness of assassinations.
Shouldn't the subordinate class ignore anything discouraging this since if it was effect it would be obfuscated?
What exactly doesn't work? Do bullets bounce off of booj skulls?
And if it's ineffective why do the booj spend so much money protecting themselves from physical security to propaganda?
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 No.496277

>>496267
>You're never, ever, going to convince Americans that violence is the answer.
Most Americans already know it.
>"Terrorism" or, actions perceived as such
By who?
This is a completely idiotic, meaningless metric - you're not measuring anything, just reasserting the implicit position of the powers-that-be without any actual understanding for whether or not the propaganda even resonates with the general public, and without the necessary understanding that said powers-that-be simply opt to class anything they don't like as "terrorism" regardless of whether or not anyone actually believes it.

>only makes people more radically right wing.
Except the vast, vast, vast majority of violent (IE assault, killing, maiming, etc.) political activity in the US has been right-wing for decades. With this considered, it's also worth pointing out that the "right wing" is not the enemy of the left - the enemy of the left is the capitalist, the imperialist. What we have to worry about isn't a non-existent anti-left popular consensus, it's the hired goons of the capitalist class who already surveil us, beat us, disappear us, gas us, and wage terror against us and against people around the world whether or not they fight back. Any analysis which ignores this reality is, at best, infantile.
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 No.496278

>>496275
The booj have started entire world wars that have gotten scores of them killed.
Self preservation doesn't explain it.
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 No.496279

>>496276
>wouldn't it be in the dominate class' interest to LIE about the effectiveness of assassinations.
Bingo!
I say it isn't a panacea, but it very clearly is a real tactic which can be utilized with positive effects just like any other tactic.
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 No.496280

>>496275
Okay, then why does this state spend so much money on the protection of the booj.
If they're all interchangeable then why would it matter to the gov which one of them lives or dies.
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 No.496281

>>496275
If that's true then how can you say the booj are immune to violent coercion?
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 No.496282

>>496276
If everything is a lie and truth is impossible to determine, then there is no point in studying history.
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 No.496307

>>496278
wars arent started by "the booj"
you give them way, way too much credit
capitalists are the servants of capital, not its avatars
furthermore, capitalism is driven by the behavior of the workers not the bourgoisie, hence why the workers need to organize and dominate capitalism… aka socialism
war is political negotiation through force, and plenty of "the booj" dont have a say in it
stop being spooked by pseudo leftist garbage
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 No.496308

>>496280
because they use the state to protect their own private interests, duh, why wouldn't they?
seriously, think about it. if all the wealthy and powerful died tomorrow, what do you think would happen?
it is already known that hierarchical economies with markets and inheritance naturally generate an upper class, wealth distribution follows the pareto principle
or do you instead think that we live in some shitty YA dystopian novel where youre stamped with a tattoo that says "ugly" if youre a worker and "pretty" if youre a capitalist?
capitalism creates capitalists, not the other way around, this is so obvious that it shouldnt have to be said but somehow im saying it
you just want an excuse to justify your retarded feelings
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 No.496309

>>496279
another retarded sentiment
its in the interest of the dominant class to be against assassinations towards their class REGARDLESS of whether its true or false, it says absolutely nothing about the effectiveness of assassinations
nobody on this fucking site understands socialist theory, let alone a grasp of simple logic
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 No.496310

>>496281
i never said this, of course capitalists are violently coerced, by other capitalists no less
im saying that even if this is necessary it still is neither desirable nor ANYTHING CLOSE TO SUFFICIENT for a socialist movement to succeed
what, do you think the success rates of revolutions are determined by the number of guillotines being used?
assuming you arent just abusing socialism to justify your sick fantasies, you actually need to get some fucking political economy in your head first
go watch a cockshott video or something

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