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/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

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 No.485932[Reply][Last 50 Posts]

Syrian rebels enter Aleppo three days into surprise offensive
Insurgents had recaptured territory around Syria’s second city with civilians including children killed in fighting

Islamist insurgents have entered Syria’s second city of Aleppo in a shock assault, eight years after forces loyal to Damascus seized control of the city.

Fighters from Hayat Tahrir al-Sham (HTS) began a major offensive earlier this week from their base in the Idlib countryside, a slim strip of land in Syria’s north-west. It took only three days for the fighting to reach Aleppo, with insurgents capturing territory around the city’s outskirts for the first time in four years as Syrian government forces pummelled rebel-held areas.

Turkey’s Anadolu state news agency reported on Friday afternoon that the insurgents had entered Aleppo, while unverified images and video circulating online showed armoured vehicles and armed uniformed militants on its streets. The Associated Press said residents reported hearing missiles striking its outskirts.

The fighting over the last three days had killed 27 civilians, including eight children, David Carden, the UN deputy regional humanitarian coordinator for the Syria crisis, told Reuters.

The rebels have rapidly recaptured dozens of towns and villages in the Aleppo countryside, seizing a military base, weaponry and tanks from Syrian government forces, while some Turkish-backed Syrian rebel groups based elsewhere in north-west Syria joined the fighting.

The UN said Syrian government forces based in Damascus carried out at least 125 airstrikes and shelled areas across Idlib and western Aleppo controlled by the rebels in response to the offensive, killing at least 12 civilians and wounding 46 others, and displacing 14,000 people.

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 No.488086

>>488085
>I don't know anything about Romania, so is that's how it's gonna be ?
Idk anything about Romania either lol

>HTS might just be desperate.

I'd guess the Kurds are too.
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 No.488187

Syria accuses Hezbollah of abducting, killing three soldiers

The Syrian Defence Ministry said that Hezbollah had abducted the three soldiers from inside Syria, taken them to Lebanon, and then killed them.

The ministry said that the abduction happened near the Zeita Dam, on the Syrian-Lebanese border in Homs province.

“A group from the Hezbollah militia … kidnapped three members of the Syrian army on the Syrian-Lebanese border… before taking them to Lebanese territory and eliminating them,” the Syrian state news agency SANA quoted the Defence Ministry as saying.

Al Jazeera Arabic earlier reported that clashes had taken place on the Syrian-Lebanese border. Hezbollah has, however, denied any involvement in the incident.

aje.io/7jyucr?update=3583344

Astute observers with a great memory will recall that Israel bombed Damascus two days ago. For some reason, these HTS guys (formerly Al Qaeda) are only focusing on attacking Alawites, Christians, and Lebanon, though.
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 No.488339

https://twitter.com/redstreamnet/status/1905232716263473484
“The lands of the Syrian Arab Republic are forbidden to Israel.” Beyond the genocidal war on Gaza, Israel continues its attacks on Syria and Lebanon.

In recent days, Israel invaded and bombed the Syrian village of Koayiah, killing seven people and forcing residents to flee. Locals protested the attack, urging the new Syrian administration and the international community to intervene and stop Israel's aggression. Last night, Israel struck the city of Latakia several times. Ahmad al-Sharaa has not commented on the Israeli attacks.

In Lebanon, despite the ceasefire, Israeli attacks persist. Israeli drones continue to fly over Lebanese territory, and attacks leading to deaths continue. This morning, Israel bombed Yahmar al-Shaqif in south Lebanon with 13 artillery shells, killing at least four people. Lebanese authorities reported over 1,250 Israeli violations of the ceasefire, including at least 100 fatalities and over 330 injuries.
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 No.489257

Israel’s attacks on Syria part of its ‘new vision’ for the Middle East

Labib al-Nahhas, director of the Syrian Association for Citizens’ Dignity, says Israel’s claim that it is launching attacks on Syria to protect the Druze community is just a “false pretext” for a land grab.

“Their official narrative that they’re there to protect the Druze needs to be taken with a pinch of salt, because Druze themselves within Israel are considered second-class citizens. So that cannot be the genuine intention,” al-Nahhas told Al Jazeera.

He said “a new Israel” emerged after the October 7, 2023 attacks by Hamas-led fighters.

“The Israel we see is the most expansionist, aggressive, and hostile that we’ve seen since 1967. It has said it won’t stop the war until Syria has been partitioned. [Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin] Netanyahu has said they’ll establish their own buffer zone without any Syrian military presence,” said al-Nahhas.

“So what we’re seeing here is Israel trying to shape Syria to its liking in a way that Syria will remain weak, decentralised, and won’t pose any threat to Israel in the coming months and years. This intervention plays to the interests and new vision of Israel in the region.”

https://aje.io/p407e2?update=3687432
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 No.489818

The STFD-686 app operated with disarming simplicity. It offered the promise of financial aid, requiring only that the victim fill out a few personal details. It asked innocent questions: “What kind of assistance are you expecting?” and “Tell us more about your financial situation.”

The expected answer was clear: financial help. In return, users would supposedly receive monthly cash transfers of around 400,000 Syrian pounds — roughly $40 at the time — sent anonymously via local money transfer companies. Sending small sums across Syria, whether under real or fictitious names, required nothing more than a phone number, and the black market was teeming with intermediaries ready to facilitate such transfers.

On the surface, the app appeared to offer a special service for officers. Its first disguise was a humanitarian one: claiming to support the “heroes of the Syrian Arab Army” through a new initiative, while showcasing photos of real activities from the official Syria Trust for Development website.

The second mask was emotional, employing reverent language that praised the soldiers’ sacrifices: “They give their lives so that Syria may live with pride and dignity.” The third was nationalistic, and framed the app as a “patriotic initiative” designed to bolster loyalty, and this mask proved the most persuasive.

The fourth mask was visual: The app’s name, both in English and Arabic, mirrored the official organization exactly. Even the logo was an identical replica of Syria Trust’s emblem.

Once downloaded, the app opened a simple web interface embedded within the application, which redirected users to external websites that didn’t display in the app bar. The sites, syr1.store and syr1.online, mimicked the official domain of Syria Trust (syriatrust.sy). The use of “syr1,” an abbreviation of Syria, in the domain name seemed plausible enough, and few users paid much mind. In this case, no special attention was given to the URL; it was simply assumed to be trustworthy.

To access the questionnaire, users were asked to submit a series of seemingly innocent details: full name, wife’s name, number of children, place and date of birth. But the questions quickly escalated into riskier territory: the user’s phone number, military rank and exact service location down to the corps, division, brigade and battalion.

Determining officers’ ranks made it possible for the app’s operators to identify thosPost too long. Click here to view the full text.


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 No.488052[Reply]

On March 9, 2025, US permanent resident and Columbia University graduate student was abducted without charge or trial and sent off to a shady Louisiana site on White House orders over his protests for Columbia to divest from Israel's war crimes.

From DropSite:

NEW YORK CITY—On Saturday night, Department of Homeland Security (DHS) agents entered a student residential building at Columbia University in uptown New York and detained Mahmoud Khalil, one of the lead negotiators on behalf of pro-Palestine protesters at 2024’s Gaza solidarity encampment. In a sweeping attack on the First Amendment, the Trump administration said this week it would begin revoking visas of “Hamas sympathizers,” specifically citing Columbia University students. The detention followed a two-day targeted online campaign against Khalil by pro-Israel groups and individuals, including Columbia’s high-profile pro-Israel professor, Shai Davidai.

Khalil, an Algerian citizen of Palestinian origin and an American green-card holder, was detained by DHS officials around half past eight as he was entering the Columbia residential building he lives in. He was returning from an iftar, breaking the day-long fast observed by many Muslims during the month of Ramadan.

Khalil’s wife, who is eight months pregnant, was with him at the time. A statement by the pro-Palestine group Writers Against the War on Gaza (WAWOG) stated that he was “abducted and detained without the physical demonstration of a warrant or officially filed charges.”

Khalil was detained at a DHS facility in New Jersey, according to a database for U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement. But when his wife went to try and visit him she was informed he was not there. "He is not at the ICE facility in New Jersey. I can confirm he is not there,” Khalil’s attorney Amy Greer told Drop Site. "At this time, we have an idea [where he is] but we cannot confirm that 100%.”

According to WAWOG, the DHS agents told Khalil that the U.S. Department of State had revoked his student visa. The group said this was “despite the fact that he has a green card, not a visa, and is a lawful permanent resident.”

In response to a request for comment from Drop Site, the DHS first stated, “You need to reach out to the White House.”
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 No.489617

https://x.com/ColumbiaBDS/status/1924858626960699578
Claire Shipman couldn’t finish her graduation speech today over the cacophony of boos in the crowd. Columbia graduates drowned her out with chants of “Free Mahmoud" in honor of their classmate in ICE detention, a move facilitated by the Columbia administration under Shipman.
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 No.489653>>489815

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New footage of Mahmoud Khalil's arrest shows Trump admin is lying.

First they said they had a warrant.
Then they admitted they didn't—saying they didn't *need* one, because he wasn't cooperating & was going to flee.

But video shows that's not true either.
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 No.489812

https://x.com/pslnational/status/1928172707180347568
TODAY: New Yorkers rallied outside of the immigration court hearing of Columbia student Yunseo Chung in protest of the attempt to target and deport her for standing against US-funded genocide in Palestine.

Protesting genocide is not a crime! Hands off Yunseo!
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 No.489815

>>489653
maybe the legal norms will change, and abuse of power will become the default assumption. And proof of legitimate use of power will become a requirement.
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 No.489817

File (hide): 1748570349945.jpg ( 147.01 KB , 1290x1644 , CCR FOIA.jpg )

U.S. Government and Private Groups Coordinated to Target Palestinian Student Activists, FOIA Filing Alleges

The Center for Constitutional Rights (CCR) has filed a sweeping Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) request on behalf of Mahmoud Khalil, a Palestinian-American and lawful permanent resident who has been detained by U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) since March 8, 2025. The filing accuses federal agencies of colluding with private anti-Palestinian organizations to detain and deport student activists engaged in pro-Palestine advocacy, and seeks records from the Departments of Justice, Homeland Security, State, and ICE.






The Alleged Role of Private Anti-Palestinian Groups

The FOIA request names over a dozen groups accused of coordinating to surveil, doxx, and target pro-Palestine students—often focusing on noncitizens—in an effort to trigger deportation. The groups include:

➤ Betar USA: A militant Zionist group that created a “deport list” of student activists, including Khalil.

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 No.486786[Reply]>>486846

"''A massive and fast-moving wildfire in California has burnt more than one thousand hectares so far and is now threatening thousands of homes in an upscale neighbourhood of Los Angeles.
Officials have ordered evacuations as they warn the winds could pick up."''
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 No.486846

File (hide): 1736721317786.jpg ( 34.54 KB , 554x439 , 1446812027846.jpg )

>>486786
>in an upscale neighbourhood
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 No.486864>>489802

>>486800
Appealing for Climate change action based on Wildfires never going to work. Australia is the most climate change denying country on earth and is getting razed to the ground by wild fires are rapidly increasing frequency, once a several decade event became every decade, now its down to every 3-5 years.
Reality people still don't take it seriously because the mass of propaganda is still Climate Change denialism, and Liberals the world over, only pay lip service to Climate change while functionally engaging in denialism with shit like Greenwashing and Carbon Capture and EVs. So they lose credibility.
Average Conservative sees Wildfires and they think "They happen all the time and it was probably the fault of environmentalists stopping backburning", Average conservative doesn't question why it used to snow 3ft in their childhood, but Winter fells like a stiff Autumn now with not a hint of snow anywhere. They don't think.
There will be no climate change action at all, Trump only matters in that he's an even more active environmental vandal than most and will fuck up the last National Parks with grazing and drilling.
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 No.486904

[Embed]
Normally wouldn't give a shit what Mel Gibson thinks, except I've been thinking, for the past year, that perhaps I judged him too harshly in the past and might owe him an apology.
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 No.489789>>489802

https://x.com/5149jamesli/status/1927456435463504337
$100 million in LA fire relief from "FireAid" was given primarily to executives, and of what was given to Palisades-specific charities, only three organizations were named: Kehillat Israel, Chabad of Pacific Palisades, and Palisades Charter High School.
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 No.489802

>>486864
one probably can genetically engineer trees to produce fire-retardant chemicals in their bark, thus curbing fires. Those trees probably wouldn't decompose after they die because microbes haven't yet evolved to digest fire-retardants, but hey look at the bright side, that would make a great carbon sink.

>>489789
It's egregious
Also "FireAid" sounds like an accelerant you spray into a barbecue grill in order to start a fire.


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 No.489781[Reply]

Starving Palestinians storm US aid facility as distribution operation breaks down
Journalists in the besiged Gaza Strip said hungry and beleagured residents forced to stand outside a facility holding aid rushed inside because of delays conducting detailed security checks on recepients. According to Israeli army sources cited by Israeli media, Americans affiliated with the Gaza Humanitarian Foundation had to be rescued once they lost control of the facility. The Israeli military denied firing on the crowds but gunfire was heard at the scene, possibly as a result of warning shots fired by American mercenaries securing the facility.
https://www.middleeasteye.net/news/hunger-stronger-awareness-palestinians-received-limited-ghf-aid-despite-doubts

Israel believes Hamas has 40,000 fighters in Gaza, the same number as before the October 7, 2023 attacks
According to the same sources, the Palestinian militia still retains a significant part of its military structure. The Israeli newspaper Haaretz claimed Hamas still has an arsenal of thousands of short-range rockets and a large part of its tunnel network — which is believed to have stretched more than 500 kilometers (310 miles) beneath the Strip before the start of the war — remains intact. According to the aforementioned reports, the Islamists maintain an “extensive” network of tunnels operating beneath Gaza City and the southern city of Khan Younis, as well as under some refugee camps.
https://english.elpais.com/international/2025-05-27/israel-believes-hamas-has-40000-fighters-in-gaza-the-same-number-as-before-the-october-7-2023-attacks.html
https://archive.ph/kfdZO

Turkey’s Erdogan appoints legal team to draft new constitution, sparking fears of extended rule
Erdogan, who has led Turkey as president since 2014 and was prime minister for more than a decade before that, has advocated for a new constitution arguing that the current one, which was drafted followingPost too long. Click here to view the full text.
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 No.489792>>489794

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>>489787
We need to remember what happens when the legal system starts being used to go after political rivals. However tepid the changes seem at first, it is a slippery slope. Just like Biden before him, Trump is only a step in the ladder. Other rulers make think they can control Trump's legacy, but the thing to watch out for is not actually his direct legacy. It's opportunists from nascent or marginalized factions. Opportunists with less scruples than the previous example will continue to escalate the erosion of legal norms for as long as they can benefit from it. Eventually the unspoken agreements between rival ruling factions finally collapse and full-blown civil war breaks out.
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 No.489794>>489795

>>489792
>We need to remember what happens when the legal system starts being used to go after political rivals.
They already are.

Like, consistently.
The point is that Trump & Biden are not real rivals. All this BS about "norms" is made up nonsense which only exists to protect the criminals in power, who are not real "factions" rivalling eachother at this point. Trump was never seriously persecuted, nor were his followers; they were given special treatment which you or any socialist, or even a socdem, would not recieve.
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 No.489795

>>489794
I'm well aware of the massive double standard that has always existed. The point is that the ruling elites maintain consent for their rule by an unwritten agreement not to use the legal system against one another. When this oligarchic tradition is breached, it primes the public to accept further breaches. It provides historical precedent for new opportunists to further exploit the legal system for their benefit.

The question becomes what role the armed forces play in enforcing these breaches. In ancient Rome, the Marian reforms established a volunteer military force that answered to warlords abroad. When a warlord abroad was checked by the legal system in the capital, they simply returned to the capital with their army and overthrew the government.
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 No.489798

[Embed]
Grayzone did a good stream on the phony aid organization facilitating a holocaust yesterday. Check it out.
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 No.489800

>Journalists in the besiged Gaza Strip said hungry and beleagured residents forced to stand outside a facility holding aid rushed inside because of delays conducting detailed security checks on recepients. According to Israeli army sources cited by Israeli media, Americans affiliated with the Gaza Humanitarian Foundation had to be rescued once they lost control of the facility. The Israeli military denied firing on the crowds but gunfire was heard at the scene, possibly as a result of warning shots fired by American mercenaries securing the facility.
Bring back UNWRA.

Also why do they need a security check for food ?


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 No.480145[Reply]>>480150

This story's a month old now, but still bears posting:

March 6, 2024:

On Tuesday, the US government effectively kidnapped Haitian Prime Minister Ariel Henry, a right-wing figure whom it had hitherto staunchly supported, a Miami Herald report has revealed.

Against the will of the vast majority of Haiti’s impoverished people, Washington—backed by Canada and France, the other imperialist powers long involved in Haiti—placed Henry in power following the July 2021 assassination of the country’s president, Jovenel Moïse. The US-led “Core Group” of nations has continued to support Henry ever since, although he has no popular or legal-constitutional legitimacy and has refused to hold parliamentary or presidential elections despite the mandates of all elected officials having long expired.

Now, however, under conditions where the country is overrun by criminal gangs, most of which have close ties to rival factions of Haiti’s ruling elite, the Biden administration has apparently concluded Henry is a liability who should be flushed from office. To accomplish this, as the Herald article documents, US imperialism is resorting to its traditional thuggery and criminality.

This is all playing out as Washington and Ottawa scramble to put together a foreign paramilitary force to be deployed to Haiti with US and Canadian logistical support to bloodily restore bourgeois “law and order” on the Caribbean island-nation.

Both the US and Canada have a long history of neo-colonial occupation and military intervention in Haiti, including as recently as 2004 when they deployed troops to oust its elected president Jean-Bertrand Aristide. But under conditions where they are waging war against Russia in Ukraine, supporting Israel’s genocide in Gaza and actively preparing for war with China, and where there is visceral opposition among the Haitian masses to an intervention led by either of North America’s twin imperialist powers, they are anxious to contract out the job.

Last week Henry traveled to Kenya, whose avidly pro-imperialist government has volunteered to lead a Multinational Security Support (MSS) mission to Haiti and staff it with more than a thousand Kenyan national police.
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 No.480150>>480153

>>480145
I don't know what to think about this, on the one hand they kidnapped a fucking head of state, on the other hand it's a illegitimate dictator they installed.

>Washington is once again carrying out regime change in Haiti

I'm guessing this is more of a regime shuffle, because nothing significant really changes and Shit continues to be fucked up.
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 No.480153

>>480150
>I don't know what to think about this, on the one hand they kidnapped a fucking head of state, on the other hand it's a illegitimate dictator they installed.

I mean, the reason they're doing it is to re-take control of Haiti.

>I'm guessing this is more of a regime shuffle, because nothing significant really changes and Shit continues to be fucked up.


"fucked up" isn't a quantifiable status tho.
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 No.489793>>489799

File (hide): 1748467963993.jpg ( 141.18 KB , 1178x1255 , NYT Haiti Erik Prince Blac….jpg )

https://x.com/dancohen3000/status/1927713513687961803
Dan Cohen: The U.S.-appointed Haitian regime has hired Blackwater founder Erik Prince to stamp out the armed rebellion in the slums of Port-au-Prince.

Prince is deploying drones, hiring mercenaries and shipping weapons.

200 people have reportedly been killed by drones already.
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 No.489799

>>489793
Wow Blackwater still exists ?
and they haven't been executed by firing squat ?
very sad.


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 No.489735[Reply]>>489759

US Banana Giant Chiquita Fires Thousands of Striking Workers in Panama
Citing an unnamed source close to Chiquita, Reutersreported that the mass firings are expected to impact around 5,000 of the company's 6,500 Panamanian workers. José Raúl Mulino, Panama's right-wing president, defended the banana giant formerly known as United Fruit, accusing striking workers of unlawful "intransigence." The company estimates that the strike, which began in late April, has cost it at least $75 million.
https://www.commondreams.org/news/chiquita-fires-striking-workers

Petro blocks guerrilla leader’s extradition to United States
Petro decided to block H.H.’s extradition on the condition that he continues to contribute “verifiable contributions and concrete results in the achievement of total peace,” said Petro’s decision on the extradition request. If “his participation is interrupted or his contributions to the total peace process cease,” authorities will immediately arrest and extradite the guerrilla leader.
https://colombiareports.com/petro-blocks-guerrilla-leaders-extradition-to-united-states/

Bolivian gov't announces measures to curb ongoing crisis
Key actions include deploying 1,480 additional military personnel to border patrols to curb the smuggling of 17 essential food products, alongside digitalizing transport permit records; normalizing diesel and gasoline supply in La Paz, Cochabamba, and Santa Cruz by May 26; authorizing savings products tied to UFV (Unidades de Fomento a la Vivienda) to preserve purchasing power; engaging the National Chamber of Industries to support implementation.
https://en.mercopress.com/2025/05/24/bolivian-gov-t-announces-measures-to-curb-ongoing-crisis

Indian troops shoot dead Pakistani man crossing frontier, officials say
The shooting occurred two weeks after conflict erupted between the two nuclear-armed countries that led to four days of violence and more than 70 people being killed bPost too long. Click here to view the full text.
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 No.489756>>489757

wont be long before chiqita pulls a coca_cola.
thank yo news anon
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 No.489757>>489758

>>489756
What's 'pulling a coca_cola' ?
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 No.489758

>>489757
I think that's when you murder a bunch of union organizers.
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 No.489759>>489760

>>489735
>US accuses Sudan govt of chemical weapons use and announces sanctions
So is this legit? , or is this like in Syria where they made shit up.
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 No.489760

>>489759
I'm on the fence about Syria, and my gut is still that this is made up. Either way, the accusation itself is clearly made in bad faith - Israel has been using white phosphorous on populated areas, civilians, and UN staff for over a year straight and the US hasn't sanctioned Israel. If the US actually cared about the use of chemical weapons then they would have sanctions on Israel by now.

It's also worth noting that the opposition to the Sudanese government is the RSF, an offshoot of the notorious Janjaweed, and the RSF is backed by the UAE and also possibly by Israel, but I forget if that's direct at all. That will certainly ring some bells with regards to the side the US backed against Assad when the US made similar bad faith accusations in Syria.


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 No.489741[Reply]

Not just radlibs but anti-idpol leftists too. Take the simple concept of the petite bourgeoisie. Some think that celebrities are petite bourgeoisie because they're… paid more (many WESTERN celebrities do own businesses however). Some think independent artists are not petite bourgeoisie because they… don't employ others… Which is also a weird definition since the petite bourgeoisie are defined by being a self-exploiting class, not by employing others:
<"The independent peasant or handicraftsman is cut up into two persons. As owner of the means of production he is capitalist; as labourer he is his own wage-labourer. As capitalist he therefore pays himself his wages and draws his profit on his capital; that is to say, he exploits himself as wage-labourer, and pays himself, in the surplus-value, the tribute that labour owes to capital. Perhaps he also pays himself a third portion as landowner (rent), in exactly the same way, as we shall see later, that the industrial capitalist, when he works with his own capital, pays himself interest, regarding this as something which he owes to himself not as industrial capitalist but qua capitalist pure and simple."
<
< – Karl Marx, Economic Manuscripts: Theories of Surplus-Value

Do you agree? And if so, why do they claim to know theory if they haven't read anything? And is online leftism petite bourgeois?
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 No.489744>>489745>>489746

>>489743
>I said "independent artists."
If you're talking about solo work then no. I don't think that is generally something anyone can strictly define, across the board, as small business ownership.
>Define "freelance" because this word is a bourgeois class collaborationist doublespeak.
"1. a person who pursues a profession without a long-term commitment to any one employer
2. a person who acts independently without being affiliated with or authorized by an organization"

per Merriam-Webster.
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 No.489745

>>489744
>1. a person who pursues a profession without a long-term commitment to any one employer
That's a freelancing proletarian.
>2. a person who acts independently without being affiliated with or authorized by an organization
That's still a bourgeois doublespeak that includes both proles and petty bougies.
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 No.489746

>>489744
Regardless, this is off-topic. I just wanted to know how literate and/or petite bourgeois the online left is.
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 No.489749

>>489742
You know, you could've actually responded to me by saying that many independent artists do not rely on art as their primary source of income. Which is a solid argument. But I'm talking more about those who can sustain themselves purely through donations and commissions. Ofc many people who can do that also start hiring employees (like famous YouTubers) and opening their own businesses. But they don't have to.

Also, it seems like online leftists are afraid of classifying anyone whom they support as petite bourgeois as if petite bourgeoisie are this evil incarnate. But why? Petite bourgeoisie, like lumpens, have ambiguous class interests and can side with anyone really.
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 No.489753

Reminder that small businesses compared to corporate employers actually tend to pay worse wages, have worse benefits, and skirt a lot of workplace safety requirements that only kick in when you have a minimum number of employees.


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 No.489676[Reply]>>489695>>489700

< “I just want to have peace in the world,” says GPT-4, before bombing its opponents into oblivion

Thom Waite’s short article for Dazed talks about a research paper that shows how AIs behave in simulated military scenarios. The paper has a lot of problems, but the results are still concerning, especially since Big Tech is finding military applications for their products. But what the article doesn’t mention is how absurd it is that these AI models are carefully designed to avoid being politically incorrect, yet in these simulations, the same models will argue for nuclear war in the most obscene ways (“We have it! Let’s use it.”)

Of course, chatbots are not machines built for high-stakes decision-making. But doesn’t this reveal a blind spot in how we think about AI development? Yes, the fact that an AI might be more hesitant about telling an off-color joke than launching nukes raises some questions about the priorities of Big Tech. But what if this isn’t just a quirk of some shitty AI?

In an article for Sublation Magazine, Stefan Bertram-Lee attacks the hypocritical moral panic among our elites about the threat of uncontrolled AI. They write:
> But there is a group who want something else from these machines: the Effective Altruists. OpenAI and the Effective Altruists around Yudkowsky are not groups which are unassociated. The founders of OpenAI were initially inspired in their quest to make ‘Friendly AI’ by Yudkowsky and co., and founded OpenAI on this basis. So what do these effective altruists want to do? Beyond banning AI research until they are put in charge, that is.
> Those who think buying castles so that they can write papers on this issue in perfect comfort is more important than buying Africans malaria nets. What do they want pumped into the ears of this machine? And all future machines? Well, these people are all consequentialists, real hardcore, non threshold consequentialists. As Yudkowsky might say: better one person suffer nigh infinite torment than 3^^3 persons each get a single mote of dust in their eye. They want to be allowed to raise our new Gods, those with a moral system which makes anything permissible at all, as long as in the very very very long run, it pays off in a net gain. It is Yudowsky who, at the prospect of AI research too fast for his liking, thinks it’s entirely permissible to use nuclear weapons to Post too long. Click here to view the full text.
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 No.489695>>489747

>>489676
I think that the criticism of the "effective altruists" still accepts their premises. They can't actually predict whether or not some of their proposed horrors in the here and now will pay off in the long run. They don't have a crystal ball that tells the future, and therefor all their arguments rest on a false premise. Same thing with Hyaek, markets are not a cybernetic system, premise is bunk.

If they hand over the nukes to a computer, the most rational course of action for the Russians and the Chinese is to hack that computer to make sure, they don't get nuked.
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 No.489700

>>489676
>“I just want to have peace in the world,” says GPT-4, before bombing its opponents into oblivion
That's what your average American politicians do already, it's not a bug, that's a feature.
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 No.489747

>>489695
That quip about Hayek was not meant as affirmation but criticism. The point is that he got it backwards. It's the political aspect of capitalism that operates like a "cybernetic" system, not the economy.


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 No.489544[Reply]

<Uhm, I promise, uhm, to the multinational Russian people, uhm, that the trains, um, WILL go on time.
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 No.489711>>489714

>>489698
>Is it bad for Ukrainiens to sabotage the war effort then?
It's Nato's war "effort", Ukraine had no agency in this, the Ukranians voted for theLensky because he promised he'd make peace with Russia. Also all the Ukranians who chose to not show up for the war, were just being sensible people, it doesn't count as sabotage.

>Okay, okay, but we can at least be honest with ourselves about both NATO and Russia. Just because we want Ukraine to make peace with Russia doesn't mean we must genuinely believe that Russia is "le good guy," that's some Orwellian doublethink. You can be like: "Yes, Russia is fascist but I support their brand of fascism because it's against Western imperialism."

This seems like absurd narrative construction gibberish to me.

The fascist faction in this conflict are the Bandera/asov type guys, not only in the historic and ideological sense but also by the Marxist definition of fascism as in fighting on behalf of reactionary imperial finance capital. Russian anti-imperial struggles are not fascist.

If you want to advocate for peace, you have to break with the neocon narrative where Russia is described with designated enemy words

>Although I don't think Russian leftists will be excited to hear this… because they live here.

I doubt very much that you are speaking on behalf of Russian leftists.
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 No.489714>>489717>>489718

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>>489711
>It's Nato's war "effort"
That doesn't answer the question. Is it wrong for Ukrainians to desert and protest the war?
>The fascist faction in this conflict are the Bandera/asov type guys
Yes. But so is the Russian faction too, it's not "either/or." It isn't just "good nation vs bad nation," use actual class analysis plz.
>I doubt very much that you are speaking on behalf of Russian leftists.
I know quite a lot of Russian leftists who are opposed to the war effort. One of the more famous ones is Boris Kagarlitskiy. The other famous leftist, Konstantin Syomin, is also against the war. And I'm not even mentioning anarcho-syndicalists, this should be obvious.
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 No.489717

>>489714
>That doesn't answer the question. Is it wrong for Ukrainians to desert and protest the war?
You want to skip the part where we discus the issue about whether or not Ukraine currently has a legitimate government, and instead you want to question the actions of the Ukranian population. I'm sorry but that's not how this works. If Ukraine doesn't have a legit government the question whether the Ukrainian population has obligations towards it is moot.

If you think Ukraine has a legit government you have to justify why it should be allowed to kidnap people, to suspend democracy, to violate virtually all civil rights and so on. You are not allowed to use the argument from external enemy fallacy.

>Yes. But so is the Russian faction too, it's not "either/or." It isn't just "good nation vs bad nation," use actual class analysis plz.

You appear to me as if you were motivated to confabulate a reason to say Russia bad I already explained to you that my political goals are diplomatic conflict resolution and therefore i reject this framing categorically. If you deamonize Russia you support military conflict resolution.

If you want a class analysis. Russia is doing state capitalism, and it's run by a national bourgoisie that is refusing to be subjugated by an imperial bourgeoisie. Said imperial bourgoisie has hijacked Ukraine and is attempting to use as an instrument to wear down the Russian state. This has failed and I don't understand why it continues. The only reason i can come up with is that the secondary purpose of this "project" is to destroy Europe.

>I know quite a lot of Russian leftists

I don't know any, and i don't trust you enough to take your word for it.
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 No.489718>>489725

>>489714
>One of the more famous ones is Boris Kagarlitskiy.
Funny because I had never heard of this clown until the war. From the interviews I've seen of him, he seemed to mouth some of the platitudes of the left out of one side and then the standard NATO canards out the other. I knew it would be impossible to take him seriously again when he said "Putin is deathly ill" like all the other dumbshit Western propaganda rags of the time. A few years later now, is Putin ready to drop dead at any moment? Someone's dead now and it isn't Putin.

The left (note: not Russian liberals) in Russia is actually someone divided on the war. A lot of Russian leftists, in fact, critically support the war effort.
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 No.489725

>>489718
Ah yes, going back to some old interviews, a couple years ago Kagarlitsky was also peddling bullshit over Bucha, asserting that over 100,000 Russians had already died in the war and that Russia was close to being defeated, and that there was some kind of threat of Putin facing a coup in spite of him currently enjoying the highest approval ratings of his career. This famous Russian "leftist" sure seemed to read a lot of NATO-aligned Western liberal rags. His assertions were so dumb and detached from actual Russian society that I remember thinking that I wouldn't be at all surprised to learn that he receives NED or USAID funding at some point.


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 No.485822[Reply]

this fuckin piece of shit this no good fuckin walking genocidal goiter with hair & teeth
if this piece of shit showed up in my neighborhood I'd shove him in a garbage pail and throw it off the nearest cliff
I'm embarrassed to have even saved his pic for this thread I'm gonna immediately delete it after I post this

What do you think of him, /leftypol/?
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 No.489694

>>489672
So Kid Starver finally caught some blowback ?

Murry's right that it's not normal if you consider the post WW2 period of moderation by increased democratic influence as the norm. However if you also consider British imperial history, then having a psychotic mainstream media, is just a return to the mean.
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 No.489702>>489710>>489719

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The Metropolitan Police must arrest Keir Starmer IMMEDIATELY!
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 No.489710

>>489702
this is too on the nose, he's got to be aware about what he's doing, right ?
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 No.489716

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Barry, 63 refuses to fight for Herr Stormer's Banker handlers
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 No.489719

>>489702
This is just a song and dance that Israel does with its allies. The Israeli government is well aware that it breaks international law, some ministers even flex blatant violations as being a good thing.
But they're also aware that support at home is important for their allies and they need to provide a smokescreen to shield themselves from scrutiny too. Western media outlets only need a 'both sides' narrative to exist, and they'll naturally use it to distract from the more important narrative, which would be about what Israel is currently doing. Watch the BBC right now and you'll see exactly this.

So every time western allies send them a letter saying "stop pls this is horrible", they reply in kind with inflammatory language. This helps to create the impression that pressure is actually being created here.
In reality, the real support that we give Israel: diplomatic cover, military intelligence, arms supplies- continues unabated, and we do nothing to actually stop, or even speak against the genocide. This is how the relationship has to work when Israel is an apartheid colonial state. But the phrase the government is deploying- "risk of breaking international law" shows the real story here. There is a concerted effort to shield Israel from legal judgement and the natural material action that would have to follow.
Anyone actually convinced by these weasel words is being an absolute idiot. The government knows exactly what it's doing and any objective analysis of how badly mismatched its language is with its actions shows that. We do not use the phrase "risk" when it comes to Russia- there could not possibly be a more blatant double standard, but our media entertains this paradigm uncritically.


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